Christine

That's not a black person.

Turnt.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, that's good.

Really?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It was one photo that I didn't even know existed. It was an implied boudoir photo shoot.

I helped, well, so my sister went into the sheriff's department in Melbourne, Florida and was turned away. And this is also around the same time that the Florida's non-consensual pornography laws enacted. So it's not only, you know, harassing, stalking, a federal crime, it's... at this point, actually illegal in the state of Florida, this exact thing.

And if you read the statute, it is in layman's terms. It is absolutely for this exact situation. And so she gets turned away and I'm like, oh, that's bullshit. So I'm going to compile information for them. I'm going to print the statute out for you. I don't live near her at this point, but I try to go in there with her

When I'm in town one day, but I want to say it was like a weekend or a holiday and that division just wasn't open. So I was like, I'm going to leave this binder with you. You're going to go in there and get someone to listen to you. Ultimately, she went in there and they did not listen to her. And I remember...

sending them an email after the fact and being like, hey, I would be glad to come bring a training to your officers on this new law. Clearly, they don't understand the law. Please provide training and I'm, you know, a newly sworn in lawyer that would be happy to help you and train your officers with this new law.

They did not like that email and, you know, assured me that their officers were trained and doing their job.

What he's posting, because how you have... Again, it's so hard to explain this. And we were so involved in the 4chan world for so long. It sounds crazy to normal people who probably... I wouldn't know about this if it weren't for this. So on 4chan, it's anonymous. But then a lot of times they would... take their conversations offline to Kik, K-I-K, is the platform messaging system.

Again, an anonymous messaging system, and I'm mansplaining this to someone who does this for a living, so I'll stop now.

So, you know, we were trying to tie those screen names that he's leaving. So the screen names that are attached to what he's posting on 4chan, we're seeing what those people are posting. We're saying, hey, kick me at, insert kick name here, finding the ones that are connected to those specific kick names. Because again, it has to all be the same person.

This particular person had a very weird way of typing names. in which there were three periods and it's all spaced out. Not like a typical dot, dot, dot. It was like dot, space, space, dot, space, space, dot. And just very odd. Like that's not how people typically talk even on the internet, especially on the internet.

So we're using all these little clues to kind of figure out, all right, as a whole, let's zoom out. What is this person interested in? What are they posting?

We find it's, you know, the same five women and girls, because some of them are underage at the time.

With one of his other victims.

Yeah, and to tie this back to the post about the back porch, so his current fiance, again, one of the victims, you know, occasionally he would post weird things like nudes of himself even without a face. Um... Just different fetishes or desires.

And I think in this particular case with the back porch, so his fiancée at the time, that's their shared home, her testimony is kind of important at that instance of like, hey, confirm this is your back porch. And so we really wanted to loop her in, but she's his current fiancée. Can we trust this person? And, you know,

You try to think of how you would react in a situation, but not knowing the person on the other end. We don't personally know her. We didn't know any of these women. So we didn't know how they were going to react to any of this. So we weren't really quite sure when to or if we should even loop them in. So ultimately, we eventually decided, we all need to band together.

Individually, they don't care. But if we can band together, show that this is a bigger issue than just one person getting harassed, and this is an issue for society as a whole, maybe they'll take us seriously. So at that point, that's kind of when we reached out to them on any social media platform or contact information that we could find. and kind of filled them in at that point.

I compiled a, essentially a binder of like facts and circumstantial evidence that connected, because again, we don't have legal evidence at this point too. This is all kind of circumstantial evidence at this point. When we looped in the other girls, we did, again, have screenshots of some confessions and things like that.

So pretty substantial circumstantial evidence, but circumstantial nonetheless. No subpoenas at this point or anything like that. So Dana and Madison and I compile this little revenge porn for dummies kind of. Knowing our experience going into... the sheriff's office, knowing that this is going to be a fight, let's be armed with the law at least. Let's be right.

Let's have the laws printed out and referenced in front of us. They have to listen to us, right? So we compiled this little binder. We had background. We had each individual victim and like a snippet of their backstory. We had any potential law that I saw that could potentially be violated from each jurisdiction, including federal.

Again, I'm a very, very young attorney at this point, like first year, right? So, you know, I think I'm hot shit, but I don't really know that much. But I did take, you know, internet law and social media law and things like that that interested me in law school. And you have that base... you know, knowledge at least of where to find the law at least.

So I was familiar with the Florida statute because again, that was just, it interested me and I thought it was a move in the right direction.

There's no federal law for revenge porn or sexual cyber harassment or anything like that. But there are prohibitions against cyber stalking and cyber harassment.

Yes.

Um, so Dana was actually there with me too. You know, I'm, I'm marching with my little binder. And, um, again, I, I hope that most people don't ever have to go report a crime like this. But when you go, obviously you don't want to call 911. You go into the police station.

Yes. I was probably honestly coming back from work. So I already had my lawyer uniform or costume on, you know? Um, so. Okay.

You go into the, I mean, theoretically, you could call the non-emergency line, but, you know, you go into the police station. There's a desk with a police officer who is either hopefully new or did something really bad to get this position because you're just sitting behind a desk, right? And, you know, you walk up and they're like bored. They're just sitting there.

And you're like, I'd like to report a crime and fill out a police report. And then they depose you. They absolutely depose you. Well, what happened? Well, I actually have this whole thing together. So you can just read it if you want. In fact, I made a copy here. Here's a copy. Flipping through it. This isn't a crime. How'd they get the photos? You know, you hear... All of it.

And I'm like, where are your credentials? Can you just hand this off to a detective and let them make the decision on whether this is a crime or not? Not to be rude, but I don't really trust your judgment when your job is to sit behind the desk. They don't even trust you out on the street with a gun, bud. Get this to the real detective, please.

So ultimately, we were there for probably over an hour begging them just to let me fill out a police report. just for the opportunity and privilege to fill out this police report.

No, and that's what shocked me too. I'm like, at least give me the form. So ultimately I demanded that I have the form. And so he was just done with talking to me, I'm sure, and gave me the form to fill out.

Six of us go into police stations scattered all over the country. Two in New York, one in Central Florida, one in Daytona area, Madison and Melbourne, and me in Manatee County. And two of us came back with police reports, too. Wow.

So... It made its way to a detective. And ultimately, the detective looked at it and was like, yeah, we're not capable of handling this. I'm going to send this to the local FBI office. So my Manatee County Sheriff's Department is the only one out of the six that actually did the right thing and moved the file to the proper jurisdiction.

If it were anybody else, they might even still just be sitting there as local police reports, which is insane to think about, right? Yeah.

Yes. And shout out to the FBI because they are amazing ones. You can actually get to them.

No. So, okay, that's the interesting part of, I mean, it's a legal nerd interesting part. I'm sure you all have different parts that you find more fascinating. Let's get nerdy.

But that's what's so frustrating about the lack of police intervention and law enforcement intervention is when you're in law enforcement, you have an inherent authority really with probable cause to pull subpoenas, right?

I can file a lawsuit and then open discovery and then have the subpoena power to get subpoenas from different people or entities and things like that. So what Madison and I ended up having to do is file a lawsuit

The court declined... our request to do that. So we had the decision at that time on whether or not we wanted to drop it or refile the complaint with our legal names in there. And just knowing that that was going to be

on the Google forever if you Google our names and you can go in and look at all the fun drama of the case because the docket's there, whereas the other victims in the case are protected. In the criminal case, you'll notice it's everyone's initials and that's to protect victims of a crime.

Correct.

Yeah. And again, through the civil process, you're treated almost like you're a gold digger looking for money or something. Opposing counsel, the magistrate, judges, everyone is acting like this is the most ridiculous case and that...

It was just very frustrating and it was just very eye-opening on, again, being a young lawyer and just seeing it from the other side on how the system really is not set up to help you at all.

Yeah, that's part of it for sure. Yeah.

Jaina was in a fraternity and I was in a sorority. And we were paired up to do homecoming together. He was the president of his fraternity at the time. And I was nominated for the homecoming queen for my sorority.

Well, we'll solve any crime by dinnertime. Dinnertime just happened to be 10 years later, so we would have starved to death.

He fucked with the wrong ladies.

Oh, God. Like, my wedding.

Yeah. Yeah.

I really don't think I did. And if I did, I blocked it out because I think it had been so much time that if anything, I was just like, oh, he looks like shit, you know?

I think that's just... I think my exact words were, oh, they're not starving him. He was very greasy.

He's allowed to talk after all of us. And so, you know, we had the whole dramatic him turning to us and apologizing to Dana first, by the way. So that was funny. But, you know, he turns to us in the crowd and like the United States Attorney and FBI agent are kind of like standing in between us. Like, do not come closer. Like, I'm going to dropkick you kind of thing.

And the, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, like the dramatic effect and all of that.

Oh, yeah, it was super dramatic.

I don't think I remember you crying. I'm sure you did. I remember Madison crying. I remember Madison crying during her victim impact statement, too. I think I like compartmentalized myself to be in like lawyer mode. So I don't think I got emotional at all. I was just kind of like stone cold face, but I was definitely excited.

Yeah, I was just staring at him even when he was doing this whole thing. But yeah, I think I definitely remember like feeling excited, like, wow, wow. you know, this judge listened to us and was in utter shock and disbelief of how bad this was. And I think it was just that validation even. Again, like Dana was saying, there's so much, you know, sweat and tears that go into this.

From all aspects of it, that it was just, like, validating more than anything that, wow, like, if put in the correct venue, like, this, you can make a difference. And, like, they care. Like, we made a difference, you know?

Yes. And so at this point, again, probably a character flaw, but we're just like, this is funny at this point. At least that's how I'm feeling. I'm like, this is terrible, but you got to laugh, right? Like, what are the odds? So yeah, we had to go back and do a sentencing. And at this point, you know, I'm pregnant. So we were hoping it wasn't in an inconvenient time.

But ultimately, we had to go back almost a year later, I believe. Dana, do you think that sounds right?

okay, let's just take a beat. This will fizzle out. You're young. It's not a big deal. So then it kept getting worse and worse and worse. So- we ended up trying to report it to the police. And so I was kind of involved just helping my twin sister interact with the police station, researching. At this point, I'm in law school or about to go to law school.

So not that I was a professional at this point, but I was equipped a little bit better to do some research, to contact some people. So that's initially how I first got involved is truly just trying to help her deal with this terrible thing that was happening.

There were some things that weren't adding up about the coroner records. I went with you because I had had pretty good luck dealing with him previously. I was a familiar face who had dealt with him before, so that was the approach.

I felt the temperature starting to rise in the room. So I think I tried to change the topic or at least let him talk about something he wanted to talk about to bring the temperature down.

I did feel like the tension is him feeling like that additional clarification or the additional specificity was somehow challenging his authority or somehow accusing him of lying or not being forthcoming for some nefarious purpose when that was not it at all.

I've been in some hostile interviews where you kind of expect it. I didn't expect it here because I thought these are very common sense questions. Why can't he answer?

And his record showed a gap. His response was, you know, we don't always log everything. You know, sometimes we do, sometimes we don't.

So this was an aberration, and you were pointing it out to find out why would it be different in this case, and that's when he snapped. And I still, I was expecting him to come back with an answer, and instead he stood up, you know, his chair got pushed back, and I believe it was get the F out.

I remember, like, I'm standing up and I'm still scribbling on my notepad trying to remember each thing he was saying because there were multiple F-bombs. And I thought, this is unheard of. I can't believe he's doing this in front of two reporters. And I was trying to document as much as I could. You know, do you think you know more than I do? Take your own effing forensic investigator class then.

How dare you come in here and challenge me?

Wow.

Because his Sirius XM on his TV wasn't working right.

Well, I know four of them.

Oh, man.

I'm just joking.

Okay. No, hey, look. Just, hey, think about what life would be without if we didn't have our ladies. Well, I wouldn't have made it here, nor would any of you. Yeah.

Yeah, he was.

Who's this person?

I'm going to have a hard day, boys. A hard day.

And a long night. A what?

Nothing? Yeah, my wife told me she loved me. That's a surprise. That's a surprise. That's right. There you go.

That's true.

I will say.

We're everywhere.

That's good.

Yeah, that's him. Oh, he's giant.

Yeah.

Well, hello. I'm Christine. I'm calling from San Marcos, Texas, just outside of one of your favorite towns of Austin. And my question today is about enoughness. Because I've worked for two decades with materials, I'm an artist, that would otherwise go in the trash. So I've thought a lot about this idea of what is enough, both personally and as a collective.

It's a To Scott podcast today. Yeah. has looked like the Hunger Games for middle and senior managers in tech. And a lot of them like me were laid off in preparation for that big recession that never came last year. I assume a lot of this was due to over hiring during COVID and all that as well. And I thought I was going crazy because nobody was really covering this. But lately, Aki Ito at the

And so I'm curious what your relationship is to the concept of enoughness and wonder how you practice it in your life, how you discuss it with your kids. and how you speak about it within your spheres of influence. So, you know, generally, how do you personally square the capitalist drumbeat of scarcity and never-enoughness with the real human need to feel sated?

Business Insider has written a series of articles about it. Last week she wrote about how middle management or senior management job postings are down 42 percent since 2022. Hiring is down 43 percent and 57 percent for middle and senior managers respectively. I've seen firsthand how applications for some of these roles can be 800 people and up.

And I guess the short version of my question is, why do you think this is happening? And do you see these patterns changing anytime soon?

I have a meowing cat. Let me...

It's a bummer too for like, you know, junior employees who are coming up, you know, they don't have the people that they report to actually understand their jobs or what they do. And executives now, you know, they're going to have whatever, you know, triple digit numbers of direct reports. And, you know, these people coming, like, for example, I'm in creative.

I usually run creative teams in-house at tech companies. And I just can't see, like, you know, someone coming in for their first role as, like, a video editor or a graphic designer or whatever and getting that kind of specialized coaching and feedback that's going to usher them into the next level of their career because they're not going to have that type of experience. that type of boss anymore.

And yeah, I mean, it's not just, of course, it sucks for me right now, but it really sucks for the people who are just starting their careers and they're going to have a boss who doesn't even know their name. Especially if they're working remotely. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

It was actually, it was an act of teenage rebellion. I was writing for the school newspaper. Oh, you did it. Oh.

I changed it. I loved how it looked in my byline. You're right.

Yeah. No. No, I don't. And actually, I was listening to your podcast the last couple of weeks, and I'm like, you know, honestly, all these people we're talking about, we're talking about them because at the core, they just don't feel enough. It's more than just what you have, it's who you are, it's how you are in the world. Do you feel like you are enough? Yeah.

We profile all these people who are essentially money addicts. We wouldn't profile somebody who's a heroin addict on your show, but we're like, cool, let's talk more about this money addict. This guy that's never going to fill up, never going to feel enough. Well, that's true.

But I think it comes from within, right? Like, I think it comes from within. I think that this is the crux, right? There's no amount of stuff in the world. And again, capitalism builds this in us. Capitalism builds inside of us. Like, that's what marketing is. It's literally the science of creating scarcity.

And I totally hear that, and I think that's true. But then I also hear you talking about, you know, you extol the virtues of Xi'an and Timu as great, you know, consumerist businesses, right? And it's like they're doing the thing that, again, like it works for money, for capital, but it doesn't work for the planet. It doesn't work for us as individuals, right?

So it's this weird dichotomy that we're enmeshed in.

No, I love your show. And I just want to say, like, one of the things I really love about it is that you demonstrate professionalism and loving qualities in your relationship, right? Like you bring those together in a really beautiful way. And so I really appreciate that.

Was it a heartbreak?

Yes.

Because years later, I still, yeah, for sure, I was still affected by it. I still had memories of feeling hurt. It hurt me by growing, by building that relationship, that friendship, that weird friendship that we should, yeah, it was not normal.

So, you know, you have to look at two sides. You look at your side, which is a horrendous experience, compared to his side, he did nothing wrong. You know, as far as he's concerned, you were okay with it.

But I'm saying you've got to put yourself on the other side. And what is okay with him? I mean, we're playing psychology here, but yeah.

Thank you.

I do. That's where those pictures are from.

I felt horrible, but I couldn't help you. You know what I mean? I could only be there for you. I couldn't help you because what could I say or do? You were in love with him, and he made you feel those feelings, right? So how do you, as a 15- or 16-year-old,

Yes, Charlie. After last year, people have a real problem with presidential pardons. I'd like to see it changed so that in a presidential election year, all pardons must be completed two weeks prior to the first vote cast, and all pardons must be announced in some manner so that nothing can be hidden. This would allow people to consider absurd actions like Biden did prior to casting their vote.

And surely anyone that deserves a pardon the day before inauguration also deserves it prior to Election Day. Can you see any way that this could get done?

Hi, Charlie. I was super happy to be at AmFest in December. It was an absolutely electric time. I am originally from Pennsylvania, and I have lived in northern Arizona for over 30 years. When I first moved here, the state was red, and in 30 years, it has gone south. Is Scott Pressler available to leave Wisconsin and come to Maricopa County and help us out?

So no, I know. I know. I know. I mean, you guys are amazing and everything you're doing. I am blown away by what you've created in such a short amount of time. But what can we do to get fair elections within that county, which tends to turn the entire state?

Okay, so by trait, he's an accountant. Okay. And a couple years ago, he transitioned into the mortgage industry and became a branch manager. Well, it's been a rough couple of years, huh? Oh, it was, it was, yeah. And in August of 22nd, decided that it was no longer a healthy place to be.

So it's the mortgage industry, and he spent the last couple of years trying to figure out what the next great job is for him. And unfortunately, there just hasn't been a lot of progress.

Well, it started slowing down in June and by August. Things had really just, for him, dried up. Okay. But more than that, it was just sucking the life out of him. Sure. And he was miserable.

Correct. Yep. He tried the e-commerce world for about six or seven months. Actually, more like a year.

Kind of. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. A lot of YouTube stuff.

Yes.

How'd that go? He understood.

He apologized, recognized me. you know, the failure in providing for the family and, you know, needing to find a job and turn things around.

Me. Okay. Yeah. So I am the sole income for our family. He has a daughter and we are not receiving any child support from his ex-wife. So everything is sitting on me financially from end to end.

No. I mean, she's my stepdaughter, but no, she's not my daughter biologically.

A little over 10 years.

I do. The relationship is really strange. Um, she's got a lot of trauma with her mom, so she doesn't trust women. And, um, her dad is the end all be all. And so we're more like friends than I, than she's my daughter. Not for lack of trying. It's just the circumstance.

Um, that's a whole nother thing.

I'm trying to figure out if it's reasonable to stop supporting my husband, to cut up the credit card, to cut up the debit card, and almost force him to go get a job at Home Depot or something like that to help bring in income. So we'll actually support himself as well.

Not at all.

I was going to say that when he does something, you know, he does it well. I just. Yeah.

Well, that is true.

I'm wanting to get help to understand if it's reasonable to stop supporting my husband financially until he gets a job.

I was afraid you were going to tell me that.

No, he hasn't. Okay. I think there's an element of it there.

Well, it's really weird. So I guess technically he has a job. but he hasn't been paid for anything that he's done.

Yes. Yes. Um, I'm in my office upstairs. He's in, in his makeshift office in the bonus room, doors closed. I don't know what he does. I don't hear him on the phone. Um, if I, you know, walk in to ask him a question or whatever, he's sitting at his computer, but I don't know what he's doing. There's no tangible evidence that,

When I ask him about, you know, this deal that closed, you know, what's it look like getting paid?

Yeah.

And I just don't know how to have the conversation a different way. It's not that.

Hey, good morning, Dr. John. Thanks for taking my call.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That was actually a conversation I was planning on having this weekend.

Absolutely. So I am hoping to get some help with making the next right move. Quickly getting into my question, I'm wanting to get help to understand if it's reasonable to stop supporting my husband financially until he gets a job.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay.

There's a ton.

What's up? Sorry, I'm a little nervous.

I was wondering if having separate beds would help me and my husband's sex life.

Well, I just kind of was contemplating it a little bit. Why separate beds? A little bit of background. I think I have some Sorry. No, you're good. I don't know how to describe this best, but when our first night in our first apartment after being married, I woke up to him screaming.

I think there's a lot of elements into this, but I think... Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

Okay.

I'm sorry. No, you're good.

I have three. One of them's asleep. The other two are chittering.

Yeah. Did that scare you? No, no, no, no. I know.

Yeah.

Seven, almost seven years, six, almost seven.

That was the only time that's happened, but there's been other times he's woken up and full anxiety, shaking. Okay. But that's the only time he's trained. Okay. And he's been on medication. I had to convince him the first year of marriage to get on medication, and he's improved a lot, but He says a lot that he can't sleep unless I'm next to him.

Yeah.

Yeah, and he's been doing therapy on and off. Our finances have been hard, so there's been times we just can't afford it.

It's kind of been all over the place, but he's finally found something that he really loves. It's like animatronics in the sense of manufacturing things.

You do.

Yeah.

We've had conversations about it, and I feel like he tries a little bit harder every time we talk about it.

Yeah.

His dad would rage fit, and he's bipolar. And then his mom's a borderline personality disorder, and she would manipulate him to blow, and he'd blow, and he'd never physically hurt them. But, you know, there'd be holes in the walls, and there was always a worry if they had food. Right. He became the parent to his siblings. Yeah.

I've been trying to... I'm starting a business and... Is now a good time to start a business, Christine? Well, it's kind of out of necessity. We need something. And it seems like it's going to... Be very profitable.

I think it's medical billing. It's something I can do at home. I can do it late at night when the kids are asleep.

He gets up at 5 and comes home at 6.30. He works long, and he can't push anymore over time, you know, to be able to make ends meet because it's too much emotional for him.

My mom helps out with the kids a lot. My sister's moving back in the state, and she can help me.

Yeah.

This was about a decade ago, actually. My dad got a job with Nissan in Tennessee, right by you, actually. He moved down to start the job when I was a junior. My mom stayed with me to finish high school in Michigan. Then when I graduated, she moved down with her. My senior year was just a mess, a complete disaster of mental health, emotional health.

The whole thing was just a disaster for everyone involved. I got really depressed. I started going to therapy, psychiatry, and just doing whatever I could. And so it's just been a continuing road from there.

Well, when I was 18, it was a major depressive disorder and generalized anxiety and a few other anxiety disorders. Um, this last year though, about a year and a half ago, they diagnosed me with bipolar type two.

What, what, what, what had them, why'd they do that?

Yeah. So I was on a medication, Klonopin, um, which is obviously, as you know, a suppressant, a depressant, um, And I came off of it just to see, like, you know, I think my anxiety will be okay, which it was. But then I started to see an increase in episodes of just feeling really, really good. Um, Like so good to the point where I was like, man, I feel like I'm almost on cocaine or something.

Like I feel so good. And this happened on a repeated basis about once a month. And I ended up finding a pattern and presented it to my doctors. And they said, wow, there really is a huge pattern here. It happens on the regular once a month, just like expected. So they kind of diagnosed me with it.

Yeah, because I was making mistakes and I was not catching myself and just overall being a bit destructive in my life. I also spend a lot of money when I'm kind of in that high space. So what do you like? One time I spent $500.

Quite a bit. I'm on Zoloft. I take Risperidone, Lamictal, Klonopin, and I'm missing one, Gabapentin.

Struggling to sleep. I don't have psychotic features officially. I've never really dealt with those. We usually use the psychotics mostly for me when it hits. So is it as needed? Yeah, kind of. I take it daily, but it really could be as needed.

Oh, yes. I've been seeing the same psychiatrist for three years now. Okay. And so there's definitely been check-ins once a month or so, if not more, just to kind of see my progress and how I'm doing. Okay. All right. And even she wasn't convinced at first.

Um, in this literal moment, a bit tense cause I'm on a podcast. Dude, nobody listens to this thing, Chris.

Um, all right. So you're, you're on a podcast. Yep. Um, overall I'm feeling good. I'm a little stressed about work, but I think that's a healthy amount, you know, normal work stress.

I feel pretty lethargic. I actually just put on weight and then lost it. I measured myself this morning and I'm 20 pounds down, which is not saying a lot for me.

No, I've never been classified as overweight, even when I was the heaviest I ever was. Okay, so you're very, very thin? Very thin, all of my whole life. I have the biggest gut right now I've ever had, which is, again, not saying much.

Um, no, actually it was a healthy 20 pounds. I went from one 48, which is what I was last year, which was very unhealthy. Couldn't gain weight. And then I put on like 40 pounds, 50 pounds, got to 200. And I was like, okay, I got a bit of a beer belly and I don't drink beer anymore. So time to do something about that.

Um, yeah, well, I just hope when we could talk about how I constantly compare myself to others, um, whether that be through looking at, you know, I have a friend who owns a house and he's about the same age as me. Um, and I'm sitting in my apartment right now that I can't even afford a hundred percent by myself. I still get a little bit of help from my parents. So what kind of work do you do?

I'm an insurance. I'm a property and casualty licensed, uh, customer service representative.

Unfortunately, I don't like telling people no, but yeah.

I am trying to improve my life a bit. Therapy, psychiatry, and all the works. I'm on Zola. I take Risperidone, Lamictal, Klonopin, Gabapentin.

Yep. And Klonopin? Yep. And Klonopin. Trying to get away from Klonopin eventually. I'm trying to find something to substitute it because I've been on it so long. Yeah, that one's pretty tough.

What do you want to go do, man? Hmm. You're asking me tough questions. Shoot.

You know what, if I could do anything, I would love to be a Hollywood actor. I think that'd be a ton of fun. I went to film school out here in Grand Rapids, took some acting courses, actually wasn't the most amazing at it, but I was good. So I just think it'd be something fun to do. The hours would be tough.

I don't do local theater. I don't like getting up on stage in front of people. Okay.

Meaning?

How are you? I'm good, brother. What's up, man? Um, well, I emailed in about a week ago and I got a good question for you. All right, let's do it. I am trying to improve my life a bit. I'm definitely doing that through therapy, psychiatry and all the works.

Yeah.

Fair. No, and I've built a life here, so I don't want to leave it.

Um, I'd love to be in front of the camera. Okay. That would be the best thing, which actually my boss just a week or so ago gave me a local talent agency and that I didn't know about. So it definitely is something I want to explore. Um, but being in front of the camera would be my number one thing. Okay. I'm getting the chance to screw up over and over again until we get it right.

Um, but I find something I'm running into kind of a roadblock is that I compare myself to other people, um, specifically men, but it can be anyone.

Cause then it's a safe zone to do that. Yeah.

I mean, honestly, it's like the opposite. Like you mentioned, George, I don't think he does not want to feel immaculated. If anything, we have two small children. He's like, you don't have to work. I'll work more overtime. And I'm like, no, it's okay. I'll keep contributing, and I can. But I don't want to take that away from him either as a man.

Hi, George. How are you?

I'm doing great. So my question is, I got remarried a couple years ago, and I have significantly more money than my husband. He's got maybe like $15,000 worth of a credit card and student loan debt that I kind of offered to help with. And he was like, no, no, I want to do it.

I'm just wondering if I should like push that or if I should just help him in other ways, like with like budgeting or like just,

All of it.

He's a firefighter, and he's like, I want to do it. And he's only been on for a couple years, so it's like he's making more now. So I told him to pause his contributions, which he did listen to me. And so he will probably have it knocked out in the next six months anyway.

So how would... I guess from my side and from his, like how would I... I've been working, and I don't know how you hit right on that, but you did. Because it is like a struggle for me because I feel like I've worked really hard and sacrificed, and I don't even have a college degree. I'm a really hard worker, and I don't buy things that I shouldn't. So how do I...

Yeah. I mean, I mean, with him, I feel like I bother him when I'm really like, oh, we need to be budgety. And he's like, all right, all you want to talk about is money.

I have a good amount. I have probably close to half a million, and plus I have about a few hundred thousand in a rental that I own. Right. I know I have to work on that and combining and really switching my mind.

I don't really remember. I think it was in the beginning of April.

Yeah. It's cool, actually, because I get to go on the internet and I get to go on the AOL. Text message. Text message, all of that. It's really good. It's like an extra computer, a little computer for myself to carry around.

Yeah, I actually did.

Yeah, there was a lot of people that didn't talk to me. And now that I have my sidekick, they, like, every day want to use it.

Yeah, they just want the sidekick. They don't want me with the sidekick.

No, because everybody wants stuff at some point. I think it's just natural. Everybody is going to want something in life. You're not going to go through life not wanting anything. You're not going to just go through life, okay, I have this and I have that. I don't need anything else or I don't want this. I think it's just natural for people to want things.

Basically, yeah.

I got 382. Oh, thank you. Oh, my gosh.

yeah you're like you don't need to i know and a lot of them wear earbuds as they're lifting so they don't hear the sounds they're making sure helps knock it out yeah it's so embarrassing because i'm like could you dial it could you calm the fuck down it's i know it's it's very it's performative it's because how come i can do heavy things and i don't have to go well you also just started maybe in a year you'll be like you know what

I got to make the noise.

And you know what I noticed too? A lot of iPhones scrolling.

That's what I feel.

That's what I'm saying. You got time to scroll, bro.

Some of these guys, again, I'm new to the scene. I feel like maybe they do one rep or whatever, and then they're just sitting on the thing, scrolling, looking.

I like you, too. I really like you. I feel, because I've done the Pilates and stuff, this is just, it makes you feel stronger immediately.

You know? You just feel, you feel better.

I like my gyms. My gym's too hardcore for you. You don't even know.

I got a sweatshirt and everything.

This motherfucker is in shape.

Right.

Yeah. Stupid. Fatty.

The blind guy stick?

The Adidas pants. I will say, too, because you guys have always joked, and I've heard men joke about how the upper body is jacked, but then the calves are puny.

what they skip leg day you see a lot of like jacked upper body dudes and I think a lot of times like gay dudes and they're like just like crazy guns and then these like little like pelican legs yeah it looks great I love look I love the environment I I love it like I said there's like people missing limbs and stuff and they have prosthetics it's so rad it's so hard fucking core and I a lot of people are missing limbs

Well, not a lot, but there's a few dudes in there who, yeah, and they have prosthetics and they're still lifting and they're still going. No, it's incredible, yeah. And I want like our sons to go there when they're teenagers and be like, you fucking think life is hard? Go fucking lift weights when you're missing a leg, bro.

I love it. No, I don't want to go to no pussy lady gym. Because first I thought about it, like maybe they should make a lady gym.

What? With like the weights are pink and stuff and it smells nice?

That's so fun, Tom.

Wow.

Oh, I got to talk to my trainer about it. Seriously?

Oh, I know that.

But I mean like weightlifting proper... Well, I mean they have the equipment.

Here's the deal, man.

What kind of films?

But that's a whole other culture.

I can't do it.

Do you even live bro? Like I like saying that. I like looking at them. I like listening to them. I like how there's an etiquette. They don't talk to each other. They certainly don't talk to the women that are there. I see the bros lifting and looking. But they're not going to say a word.

No. I mean, the men are so respectful, actually, at this gym. That's good. And it's lovely, and it's nothing like that.

Yeah, but I know you're talking about, and like in the Pilates community, like there's tiers to that too. Like if you want to go like rich mom Pilates, then you got to wear the right Lululemons. You got to wear the right thing.

And I'm telling you, there's always one weirdo straggler in jean shorts or he always wears the wrong fucking thing. It's not the same guy, but it's a type.

One fucking bro. in the back of the class yeah just looking just sniffing bottles yeah yeah such a fucking asshole yeah i love i feel so much better when i come yeah well i i so i haven't done the pilates group sesh yet at this place i joined but i'm curious to see if a dude will show up there because usually it's older men that'll do pilates like like

men trying to heal injuries or something, but you don't see the straggler in the Pilates class. And SoulCycle apparently is a whole other mom culture too.

I hear people even rent the bike.

Like the front, I want my front bike, so I'll pay $8,000 a year just to have my front bike. Jesus Christ. That's like in Manhattan or something, like in the G20s.

I'm just going to do the child's pose.

I do love doing the yoga class. I like to see people's b-holes and body parts.

Hot yoga or core power yoga.

Try any of them. Jesus Christ, yeah.

No, we got to do something for the ladies listening too.

We found pictures of presidents in their swimsuits, which I think, like, why not just go there?

Let's go see it.

So there's Obama. You know, Obama I always felt was attractive but not handsome where I was like, oh, I want to bang Obama.

He didn't have – He didn't have the chutzpah of a JFK, which, like, I want to bang Kennedy.

Let's do presidential scale of 1 to 10. Okay. Looks for Obama. Let's rate him only in the president scale of 1 to 10. Like, who's our 10? Are we going to say JFK is the 10? Oh, but his body's better than JFK's.

I know. Oh, you're about to see it on this list.

Okay, so look, that's like a GQ photo.

Okay, so look, I'm going to give Obama almost, what, are you thinking nine?

He's annoying.

He looks great there.

Let's go see the other swimsuit edition presidents.

Biden. He didn't do leg day ever.

No, Biden doesn't look good.

Hold on. Young Biden was kind of hot.

Yeah. Let's go younger Biden.

He's cute.

Oh, but look at that bad comb over in the 70s.

Wait a minute. That's not fair. You're going to grade him.

Yeah, it gets worse for him.

I was going to say six.

For presidents.

He's a presidential six.

Well, I would say Obama's is, what, 40s, and this is Joe in his 40s?

So 50s? Do we look at people in their 50s? Presidential 50s? How old is JFK?

Just when you think you have this game-

Presidency hotness. OK.

You're right. You're right. Presidency hotness.

I mean, the tits and everything.

How sad to be photographed.

But like, I'd hate to be photographed in my bathing suit. It's so awful.

Poor guy. OK. This is this is a disaster right now. Based on that photo, I'm going to give him the lowest. He's a one.

I'm giving... He's a three.

It's a totally different bowl game. And you're doing the UK. We're Belfast, Manchester, London, Glasgow, Nottingham.

There's nothing worse than this.

There's nobody older that's been president than Biden.

Yeah, dog show.

You know what?

I'm going to give Biden a one based on this photograph of him with his tits hanging and everything and his body sagging. It's not his fault. He's old.

It just sucked. Negative. Negative. I think you're going to see.

Okay, so now compared to Obama, it's like a 10. This is sexy right here. Look at that staged photo.

That's so fake. Dude, you and I never even pose like that. That's got to be from the 80s too. Look at that. Back when she was.

Oh, please.

No, I know, but is this before or after Monica? I don't fucking know. Is this staged right after that happens? This is such a bullshit photo.

Okay, okay, okay. But Bill?

Yeah.

Okay. Okay. Now, personally for me, I was never, I never felt he was that attractive of a prez. He was not my type.

Cardiff.

He's okay. He's good. He's real red faced, a little pink.

Remember he played the, didn't he play the saxophone?

Well, are we going on swag or are we going on looks? And I'm going based on.

I think he messed up with the Lewinsky thing. He didn't handle it.

I'm talking about swag. You said he has swag. Yeah, but then that whole thing kind of diminished the swag for me.

When he got caught with Lewinsky and then he's like, do what is in the line. And he was in court and he was doing the lawyering thing. He was like, now when I say affair, my mouth, the penis on the mouth.

I don't find him attractive. No, you said it's the whole package. What is it then?

Which is it, Segura? Is it the whole package of the swag? Or is it the bathing suit look?

No, am I crazy? Now he's contradicting himself.

And now you're going back to just the swimsuit.

And they don't have to understand.

Okay, then. Let me have it. Can I have my own level of attraction for whatever reason? It's subjective, Tom. This is a subjective sport we're playing.

Can I just ask a question?

Yeah.

Are you saying that you found him less attractive because he got caught? No. That reduced his swag?

How he handled it. The way that he handled it in court, I remember he was doing a bunch of lawyer speak and that was very unswaggish. And ever since then, I don't like him as much. He was doing these weird things and the phrasing and he was backpedaling. It wasn't attractive.

Yes, that's right. He should have just apologized and owned it and go on with it.

Wow. You did that just to spite me. That was a spiteful six and you fucking know it, Sakura.

Yeah, you know what he's got?

He's got pastor vibes.

Yeah. That's so generous. Okay. I'm comparing him in my mind. He's 65. So we have one is Biden. I'm going to give him a four. Okay.

I know, I do too. Because they think they're hiding their gut.

Yeah, and you're not fooling anybody by doing that, but I like it too.

He's on the beach.

Oh, a coconut.

Okay, but how old is he in this photo?

See, Ronnie has no muscle tone, though.

Well.

But here's the deal, man. All right, there we go.

He's got tits and a belly. But here's the thing. He had a good face. You're right. He was an actor. Look, he photographs well. He's tan there. He knew how to position himself.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

I'm going to give Ronnie a generous, on a presidential scale of 1 to 10. I'm going to rank him higher than Clinton, and I'm going to go with a 5. I am. For me, I have fond memories of Reagan when I was a little girl. Charismatic.

No.

Yeah, you're just one man.

So that's a good 73.

He looks good. And this is for old timey standards. This is the 70s.

This is like the Burt Reynolds hot era. I think he looks great. I'm going to give Gerald Ford a presidential. Gosh, I would even go seven based on that photo. Wow. Don't you think? He's holding it together. He is. Looks good.

You've been touring. You're on it forever. People are like, oh, when is Tom touring again? I'm like, he's always touring. Never not touring. You're always on the road. That's how it goes.

But again, we're going on the term of presidency.

Not the age in which you were photographed.

Looks great. Now, Nixon is the next one. And I just caught a glimpse of it. He looks really good there. Again, the high-waisted.

Yeah. He looks good.

No. Yeah. We need to bring that back. Yeah. You can't cheat now. Everybody sees everything.

Everything's so revealed.

I mean... Still, he's got something going for him. I like his air of certainty, authority.

There he goes. That's not bad.

I'm going to give Nixon, because he had a nice full head of hair. Hold on before we get there. I'm going to give Nixon a five.

Okay. All right. You can't really see, but he looks like a Gene Hackman there.

Matt, Gianna, can we go back to Bill Clinton's swag? A lot of it was a phony baloney swag. Okay, look at me. Stay with me. Stay with me. That guy is that guy is that guy, no matter what the fuck happens to him, because he's an old school cigarette smoking, whiskey drinking. I don't give a fuck.

Old school guy.

Now, Bill, scroll up a little bit. Whenever the wind.

blue yeah he wasn't steadfast in who he is you understand what i'm saying he was kind of a pussy and i didn't like that he wavered but that guy this gene hackman looking lyndon b johnson that's a real dude that's an old school guy i like that i find this this is more attractive to me than bill clinton being a pussy when the shit hit the fan you understand

I think this is more attractive. I'm going to give him a six.

Wow.

Wow.

Yeah, that's true. That's true. Now, here it is, the gold standard.

Yep.

And look at them touching the president.

Pinching his nipples, yeah. Can't do that anymore.

Could you imagine people touching the president like this now?

This fucking wet bathing suit. You can't see an outline of his dong there.

It's too bad.

I know, which sucks because I think his body is fine.

It's great.

But I think this is more attractive than like, I think that's lovely. This to me is what a man looks like. This is very lovely.

You're scrawny. Look at that little pose. Hello. Look at his tush. So gay.

Oopsie.

Yeah, right. Like, what's the one we watch every year at Christmas? We love Die Hard.

He looked just like a cop, like an in-shape cop. Yeah.

Yeah, it looks great. That was 80s fit. I liked 80s fit.

Yeah. You mean I almost got away without seeing them and now I get to see them.

Yeah.

I know. Even Marilyn Monroe's body, she wasn't, like... You know, lean and jacked. Not at all. The way models are now. No, she had a little chub on. Not chub, but just a layer of baby fat, like normal female body fat.

Towards the end of, yeah. Not in the beginning, no. Yeah, she gained a little bit of weight later.

Yeah, she was heavy when she died.

Yeah, tits were a lot of weight, man. That's for sure. All right.

Yay! Look at that.

He and his brother would tag team her.

In Malibu. Isn't that crazy? Yes. The president?

Like, oh, they just plow her.

Who's getting plowed today? Who do you think is the Marilyn of today that like presidents are dumping clips at like men of power?

Well, it's definitely like Instagram models. Like, you know, they get called over to the Middle East.

Truman. Okay.

That's one step above Biden.

Well, you guys didn't rate him. Is that 10? Oh. Who?

JFK? I think he's a presidential 10. And then right under him is Obama. Okay. The Dems are always hotter.

The male Dems, I should say. Well, yeah.

He's the gold standard.

Right. Would you agree with that assessment?

Yeah. JFK Obama.

Yeah. Those guys could have been like movie stars or whatever.

Those are hard ones.

Yeah, because we don't even really know what people look like, right? Like Lincoln, there's like paintings. I mean, there's paintings, yeah. Those are flattering.

Yeah.

It's a bad angle.

It's rough. Yeah. Who do you go for if you're gay? You have to choose.

Yeah.

Do you think he was nice? Like he would leave you presents or do you think he, you know what I mean? Like would he just come in, pump and dump and bounce or would he spend some time with you, romance you?

Yeah, because he didn't get a bad reputation for doing that. Like women weren't like, God, this guy assaulted me. They were happy to oblige, I think.

Yeah, he probably hung out, had some whiskey and cigars.

And I bet the ladies felt bad for Bill because of who he was married to. Like, you know, she wasn't touching him. And they long ago they made an arrangement. No.

I think so, too. I think someone got a hold of him and tamed him down a bit.

I don't know either.

I mean, he looked insane the last presidency. The white and the orange.

Oh, yeah.

I think so, too, Tom. And I think Melania never ages. She looks amazing.

Wow, I'm so glad we did this work.

We spent so much emotional energy on it, too. Look how heated we got, Tom.

I feel like we don't really argue about much in our marriage, and then look at this. You got really upset with me.

Yeah, I've seen this guy. This guy's pretty interesting. He's Russian, right?

Yeah.

Hold on.

The taking a shit in your underwear, I think, involves a lot more preparation. First of all, you've got to give yourself diarrhea every day to film.

Right. But let's infer that he's taking things that would induce diarrhea. So you're talking a few hours of prep work there. And then he's got to choose the underwear.

That's true.

I liked it. I liked watching it. This is more entertaining than a lot of stuff I see on television.

Oh, shit. Fuck, dude. Oh, it's good. I liked it, though. Cool Hong...

How is he laughing? How is this guy laughing?

Oh, shit.

Oh, fuck.

It was just scary.

I got scared. I thought you were dying.

I didn't like it. Can you show me? I don't like it. I want a do-over.

That was bad.

Dude, what the fuck was he doing that? What did he think would happen then?

No way, Jose.

It was awful, babe. It's not that we were laughing at you. It's that you made this horror.

What are you going to do?

Oh, okay. Wow, this guy's really official.

He's got to change his career path immediately. This guy's amazing.

What a talent. So he's sucking it in to fart. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I could watch this guy do this for hours. It's pretty cool.

What made you choke? Is it just spit from the roogies in your mouth?

You know what? You're spicy today, Tom. You're zesty. You're spicy. You're spicy. What's going on with you?

Yeah.

Right?

Yeah, and I'm a novice weightlifter. The form is wrong and the speed.

Yeah, you don't have to go that fast.

You know, right now you've got a roogie in your bottom lip and it looks like he's got 10 roogies in his bottom.

This lady's licking a flypaper strip. She's eating the flypaper strip. You don't think they taste good at all? Maybe they're tasty. I don't know. Maybe they're crunchy.

But he doesn't have any roogies in there. It's full of roogies.

You like it?

No. No.

They're crawling all over him.

They're all over him. I don't see why. It's like a live wall of spiders.

That's true, we've never seen a black or Latino cave climber. What are these, cave tunnelers?

What do you think?

Really turned on, yeah.

Babe. Stop. I'm going to be sick.

TikTok-y.

Three new shades. Four total. The perfect four.

Did you like it?

Yeah? This is for you, babe.

I'm just glad that I managed to upset you the way you upset me at the beginning of the show.

Remember that guy? It was sexual. Ew. Yeah, he wanted to lick my tits, and now you. Ew. Ah! Stop it.

Yeah, if you're going to be a lady, you've got to decorate.

I know.

It's so insensitive. I mean, yes, he's got a full beard. Who? Sorry, they have a full beard, but that doesn't mean that you're necessarily a sir anymore. No.

I know. It's so rude. Just... I agree, though. He could sit... Sorry, they could use a poster or like a painting of something.

We looked away.

That's so weird.

We are, Tom. I'm a whole new person. I'm just regrouping here. And this episode overall felt kind of dark and horny, didn't it? It felt very horny. There's a lot of sexual undertones.

Hey, you know, sometimes the algorithm speaks to me. I can't curate it.

I don't know about hitting. I would say massaging maybe.

Definitely.

And I don't know if those are new phone numbers or just he's repeating the usual suspects.

Can you try it?

It's a lot for people to write down as they're watching this.

We always love you, buddy. Good to see you're up and doing your thing and stuff like that.

Oh, that's right. Under Robert Paul Champagne.

Do it. Does it hurt? No.

You just watched your mom's house. Did you like it? Then watch another one. Watch our clips. I don't know. Check it out. Try it out. If you didn't like it, look for other stuff. Maybe in the next video, there's people getting hurt the way you like, or maybe gay dudes talking about dick stuff. I don't know. Try it out. Maybe there's always something for everybody.

Just look in these cubes, squares, whatever.

You don't think that giving your nuts some extra love would make them want to produce harder? I think it's intuitive, what he's saying. Very intuitive.

yeah i like it no i like i could watch it again initiate don't push so hard let it go that's just a fart i remember he's disappointed oh i see it oh he pees and hearts yeah but no diarrhea interesting it appears to be just urine very interesting findings more to follow

And then is this to get laid, you think, with men, or what is this?

That's such an astute observation, Tom. Like you're saying, he's a failed artist. He wants to do this. He doesn't know how to do it, but he's like, I know how to do that diarrhea stuff.

I've got my Berlin, which is a dark burgundy, a very deep, rich, moody color. I wore that yesterday around town. Madison. It's a mauve. You can wear that to drop the kids off at the mall. It's going down. Atomic Red, which is an orange-based red, and it piggybacks off the Perfect Red, which is a blue base. Get them all now. ChristinaP.com.

I think he just got the costume and then maybe backward and reverse engineered it, you know?

You think this is the lane. He's like, this is the lane.

Yeah. I mean, what I found is that you don't want to overthink the bits.

And it's always the bits that you give a lot of time and attention and intellectual thought to that don't really hit with the audience. You're much better off diarying in your underwear and making that into a video.

No one cares.

Viral.

That's the one people remember.

You can't control how the audience perceives you, Tom. You don't. All you can do is consistent output, as we've learned. And he for sure is doing that.

I love them. And I'm curious to always know the outcomes.

Never.

No. Do we have more of him? I mean, he's he's done 472.

But I don't understand why he wears the biker shorts because that defeats the purpose.

I want to see the diarrhea spill down. That's the whole point.

I would have loved to have seen that.

One of the greatest videos I got.

And it was a video that was like 05, was being sent around, and I was working in an office at the time, and I got sack lunch, and it just changed my life. Two girls, one cup, and sack lunch. Oh, and Mr. Hands... I would argue are the three most pivotal videos that completely made me fall in love with the internet and see what it's capable of.

Well, actually, I said I don't want to look like a bull dyke is what I said.

Tom.

I don't like it. I love it. You know why? Because it's, it hearkens, you know, they have Romanian deadlift. There's something about this. You just lifting heavy thing, lift it again. And then you lift it. It's very easy. And I like it. My, my brain likes it. But you know, it convinced me that it was a hot chick that did the weightlifts. A friend of mine who's very attractive.

This is what I do. And I was like, well, I want to look like you. And so I found on Instagram a lovely trainer. She's like a sweet, blonde, southern lady. The sweetest, most wonderful. And now I go to a gym that she teaches in. Teaches in? Trains? And it is a dude's gym. It is heavy metal playing. It's guys missing limbs and lifting. It's tattoos. It's smelly dick and balls gym.

Like a real dude gym and I love it. But what I've noticed, a lot of sounds.

I mean, it's a very dramatic. And you're like, I've given birth twice and I didn't make this much noise. You know what I mean? Like you guys are kind of hamming it up here.

It really is. It's the best gift for any lady in your life or fella who likes to wear lipstick.