Claude Walker

On the one hand, some really great actors that have acted with big heart.

And there are some companies that I think like AMP, which I would probably never back them to be a great option for ethical investing.

And then, you know, you've got a whole bunch of companies in the middle who I think they're being changed by the younger generation coming up.

Any sites or anything that you would... So are we talking more about individual companies now?

So the first thing you've got to check for is you've got to make sure you check, I guess, the investor webpage or the annual report so you understand all of its business units, right?

That would be the first step for new players.

And I'll tell you why that's important because otherwise you could look at something like Woolworths and be like, I shop at my Woolworths.

I like it.

know they do delivery and also like my mate works there and they're fine so you like that company um but unless you check the annual report historically you wouldn't have realized that they were like the biggest owner of pokey machines in australia so you've just got to check that you under that you know all the businesses they own uh now as it happens you know woolworth's is divesting all of that stuff now so that's that's a historical observation but

Once you know all of the businesses that that actual stock owns, then I actually think that for most people, a very, very quick Google of all of the businesses, just have a quick look at it as a consumer.

90% of the time, if you just spend two minutes understanding each of their businesses, make sure you know what it is and what it does, that will give you all like 90% of the information you will probably need to make any ethical decisions you need to make.

The one thing I find interesting is that the funds management industry has generated this extremely heavy apparatus to rate things on environmental, social governance, ESG factors.

But I don't think that's actually a good... That process has value, don't get me wrong, because that process can pick up things that might otherwise be hidden.

But I think for most of us, most consumer people, you're going to get it mostly right as long as you just know what you're investing in.

And you can change your mind as new information comes to mind.

Like an interesting one to talk about is TazSale, which went from being like back in the day, like it was, including by myself, considered very much a green stock because it farmed salmon rather than depleting wild salmon.

But then as some of the impacts and potential impacts

animal you know animal rights kind of implications of salmon farming starts coming into it and people learn more than a lot of people also myself included sort of moved away from thinking that that's something we were keen and now you see um andrew forrest getting involved in salmon farming stuff and saying that he wants it to be like you know cruelty threat free or whatever fascinating yeah i think that

Actually, speaking about the different parts of the companies is without maybe a good time to talk about RPM Global.

Sure.