Coco Kahn

And he does seem to like Macron as well. So that doesn't seem to have backfired.

Let me talk to you about defence spending, though. So you've been saying that spending needs to go up. Today, the government announced plans to do just that, promising 2.5% of GDP. The big surprise, though, in Starmer's speech was how he intends to pay for this increase. So it's our international aid budgets. It's obviously attracted immediate criticism from organisations like Save the Children.

Let me talk to you about defence spending, though. So you've been saying that spending needs to go up. Today, the government announced plans to do just that, promising 2.5% of GDP. The big surprise, though, in Starmer's speech was how he intends to pay for this increase. So it's our international aid budgets. It's obviously attracted immediate criticism from organisations like Save the Children.

They've called it a betrayal of the world's most vulnerable children. What do you think of this?

They've called it a betrayal of the world's most vulnerable children. What do you think of this?

Do you think it's genuinely possible to put money into defence and not feel the pinch at home? Because, look, all the polling suggests that the reason people are losing faith in the government and politics in general is because of the cost of living.

Do you think it's genuinely possible to put money into defence and not feel the pinch at home? Because, look, all the polling suggests that the reason people are losing faith in the government and politics in general is because of the cost of living.

And I think there will be some people in some parts of the country who, rightly or wrongly, will say, hang on a minute, why are we paying for a conflict that's really far away when in my neighbourhood there's so many children and so many things that need fixing? I mean, are these two things at odds?

And I think there will be some people in some parts of the country who, rightly or wrongly, will say, hang on a minute, why are we paying for a conflict that's really far away when in my neighbourhood there's so many children and so many things that need fixing? I mean, are these two things at odds?

Okay, well, putting aside the pinch that could be coming or shouldn't be coming, I feel like to say that you're anti-war, if you said that out loud, people would just scoff at you and laugh at you. This is ridiculous. What a terrible perspective to have. But there is just something here where an increase in defence means we're becoming a bit more militaristic, we're becoming a bit more war-ready.

Okay, well, putting aside the pinch that could be coming or shouldn't be coming, I feel like to say that you're anti-war, if you said that out loud, people would just scoff at you and laugh at you. This is ridiculous. What a terrible perspective to have. But there is just something here where an increase in defence means we're becoming a bit more militaristic, we're becoming a bit more war-ready.

And on a personal note, that does make me a little bit anxious. What does it mean to be anti-war in this day and age?

And on a personal note, that does make me a little bit anxious. What does it mean to be anti-war in this day and age?

It is strange, though. I can feel myself sometimes when I'm talking about like, can't we all just get along? But I'm like, you know, trying to put flowers into machine guns or something, which seems all very passe. Nobody's doing that anymore. But it does feel like the global temperature is rising in terms of aggression, in terms of the prospect of war. I mean, how worried are you at the moment?

It is strange, though. I can feel myself sometimes when I'm talking about like, can't we all just get along? But I'm like, you know, trying to put flowers into machine guns or something, which seems all very passe. Nobody's doing that anymore. But it does feel like the global temperature is rising in terms of aggression, in terms of the prospect of war. I mean, how worried are you at the moment?

Okay, what about being more neutral?

Okay, what about being more neutral?

I just felt I had to ask that for all the pacifists listening in.

I just felt I had to ask that for all the pacifists listening in.

So Starmer is meeting Trump on Thursday. If you were in his shoes, shaking his hand with an iron grip, what would you say to him?