Daisy Goodwin

You know, the BBC, because it can't make shows like this because it wouldn't be allowed to, has been more, you know, has shows like, you know, It Started Bake Off, It Started The Traitors, which are, you know, they're reality shows, but they're different.

They don't harm the contestants.

Well, I suppose they might, yes.

But they're not being put into positions where they're actually going to be raped, you know, or sexually assaulted.

Yes, I mean... Yes, I see what you mean about traitors.

I mean, here's the thing.

Any show where somebody goes on

and they haven't been on television before is, I mean, I'm not worried about celebrity traitors because they're all, you know, they're in the game.

Yeah.

No, I agree.

I suppose punters, but I suppose it's not the same.

It's not the same as, you know, they're not actually.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, you could argue it either way.

I feel the trait is less exploitative in a way.