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Dara Lind

👤 Person
258 total appearances

Appearances Over Time

Podcast Appearances

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

You know, the big question for Congress is really a budgetary one, is how much money are they going to throw at enforcement? Because, you know, as Matt pointed out, like, We've never done anything close to the scale of what they are threatening to want to do.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

You know, the big question for Congress is really a budgetary one, is how much money are they going to throw at enforcement? Because, you know, as Matt pointed out, like, We've never done anything close to the scale of what they are threatening to want to do.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

And the more that Tom Homan and company want to spend on, you know, getting headlines by sending a bunch of ICE agents into California, the less money there is in theory for stuff like building soft-sided detention facilities and other unsexy things that you're going to need to do to get your capacity.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

And the more that Tom Homan and company want to spend on, you know, getting headlines by sending a bunch of ICE agents into California, the less money there is in theory for stuff like building soft-sided detention facilities and other unsexy things that you're going to need to do to get your capacity.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

Just laying out what it does. The Birthright Citizenship Order declares that it is the position of the U.S. government that anyone born after February 19th of this year whose mother is... either someone who does not have legal status in the United States or who has some form of temporary visa or other temporary protection in the United States and whose father is not a U.S.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

Just laying out what it does. The Birthright Citizenship Order declares that it is the position of the U.S. government that anyone born after February 19th of this year whose mother is... either someone who does not have legal status in the United States or who has some form of temporary visa or other temporary protection in the United States and whose father is not a U.S.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

citizen or green card holder, is not a citizen of the United States by birth. Most of the text of the executive order is a defense of a very novel legal theory that is not only is the 14th Amendment of the Constitution not as it has been interpreted by the Supreme Court for over a century, etc., but that we can change that interpretation via executive action and simply declare it by fiat.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

citizen or green card holder, is not a citizen of the United States by birth. Most of the text of the executive order is a defense of a very novel legal theory that is not only is the 14th Amendment of the Constitution not as it has been interpreted by the Supreme Court for over a century, etc., but that we can change that interpretation via executive action and simply declare it by fiat.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So I don't think so. And, you know, the reason I don't think so is because, yes, we've never had a big political controversy around people on student visas having children. But there has been political controversy around people on temporary visas having kids in the United States.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So I don't think so. And, you know, the reason I don't think so is because, yes, we've never had a big political controversy around people on student visas having children. But there has been political controversy around people on temporary visas having kids in the United States.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

You know, when Trump was running for president the first time in like 2015, 2016, there were a couple of news cycles about birth tourism. Hmm.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

You know, when Trump was running for president the first time in like 2015, 2016, there were a couple of news cycles about birth tourism. Hmm.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

And the practice of getting a tourist visa, often spending that time at like a designated resort for this purpose, having a child during the time you're on the 90-day tourist visa, and then that child who is not necessarily raised in the United States but is raised in, you know, whatever their parents' home country is, has the benefit of U.S.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

And the practice of getting a tourist visa, often spending that time at like a designated resort for this purpose, having a child during the time you're on the 90-day tourist visa, and then that child who is not necessarily raised in the United States but is raised in, you know, whatever their parents' home country is, has the benefit of U.S.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

citizenship at some later point should they choose to act on it. And that was a very big target of the kind of ban and wing of the MAGA movement, which is very concerned about the lack of assimilability of, in particular, Asian highly educated immigrants who are, you know, taking jobs that could otherwise go to disadvantaged Americans.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

citizenship at some later point should they choose to act on it. And that was a very big target of the kind of ban and wing of the MAGA movement, which is very concerned about the lack of assimilability of, in particular, Asian highly educated immigrants who are, you know, taking jobs that could otherwise go to disadvantaged Americans.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So I think that it's not obvious to me that if you bisect that and say, well, we really only care about children of unauthorized immigrants, that that really does satisfy everyone because the question of birth tourism has been tied up in the question of birthright citizenship as, like, Trump world has understood it over the last decade.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So I think that it's not obvious to me that if you bisect that and say, well, we really only care about children of unauthorized immigrants, that that really does satisfy everyone because the question of birth tourism has been tied up in the question of birthright citizenship as, like, Trump world has understood it over the last decade.

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So it is surprising to me that this has continued to exist because there's so much discretion to the State Department in denying visas. Like in theory, you could have an enforcement-based approach to that that doesn't change the law. There is like an entire regime in place that is designed to prevent people from being issued visas that are going to abuse the terms of those visas, right?

The Ezra Klein Show
Let’s Get to the Marrow of What Trump Just Did

So it is surprising to me that this has continued to exist because there's so much discretion to the State Department in denying visas. Like in theory, you could have an enforcement-based approach to that that doesn't change the law. There is like an entire regime in place that is designed to prevent people from being issued visas that are going to abuse the terms of those visas, right?