David Frum

I want to put a pause button there because I think you're combining two things that in my mind, at least, are different things.

So let's bracket Zoran Mamdani, who I regard as a more sinister figure than maybe you do.

But let's talk about AOC.

I think AOC is absolutely a normal American politician.

And I have no doubt that if she were to somehow become president, if she's got a Supreme Court order saying, don't do this, she wouldn't do it.

And I don't think she would run a meme coin business while being president.

So if the question is, is this person an acceptable and unalarming, an unthreatening participant in American democracy?

Yeah, absolutely she is.

I can imagine that the scope of unthreatening American politics extends to her and then extends, you know, Marco Rubio to AOC, that's sort of the universe.

If, however you say, I, David Frum, at this microphone, or you, Tim Miller, at your microphone, do I support her?

I can draw a line by saying, I don't find her threatening.

But no, no, I don't.

And I'm not determining the outcomes of American politics.

I'm just speaking for myself.

And I can both say I find her, and if the choice were AOC or Trump, I would very unhappily and with a lot of foot dragging and grumbling and complaining to my loved ones have to put up with AOC.

But if the choice is AOC or somebody else, I choose somebody else.

And I remember that when I talk and write about her.

Again, Zoran Mamdani, I want to bracket because I think that's a different kettle of fish.

So you and your work.

One of the things that I think that led to the favorable treatment she got was a misstatement she made.