David Pivnick
Appearances
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Yeah, I'll start with it from a bit of a side angle, which is I find the whole attack on that front and the coining of the phrase taco, you know, one part clever and one part incredibly stupid. The one part that's clever about it is Clearly, the folks who are pushing it recognize fully that it's the kind of thing that will get under President Trump's skin, will irritate him, will make him unhappy.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And they're doing it, clearly, to tweak him and to get under his skin. And so from that standpoint, you can see how it's a little bit clever because they're sort of succeeding politically. in their goal.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
The flip side of that is the very people who are doing that are the same people who in the next breath would tell you what they don't like about President Trump is that he's mercurial and unpredictable and potentially will lash out. It seems weird to criticize the tariffs and criticize the approach and then do something that is almost affirmatively prodding President Trump
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
to take stronger action to avoid the taco name sticking. I feel like the very folks who are upset about tariffs and how things have played out are creating a situation where they're almost priming the pump for President Trump to take a harder stand. So from that standpoint, I find it just...
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Clever in part, but almost too clever by half or too cute by half, where they're potentially going to make the problem they're worried about worse.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
You might be right, and that's not a point I would argue. What I would say is if that's the case and you are right, I find that disappointing and somewhat intellectually bankrupt of those folks, because it's folks who are, again, fundamentally opposed to President Trump. And I think the most typical criticism that I hear about President Trump is some variation of
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
He doesn't really care about what's good for the country. He's self-interested and he just wants the chaos or to protect his own self-interest.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And so for someone to be being provocative for the point of waving the red flag in front of him to get him all riled up and have him do things improperly, those folks would be doing exactly what they claim to be concerned about President Trump doing, trying to inspire ratings. and fun news bites for their own benefit, which would be very disappointing if that was really the thought process.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
I think as much as anything else, it's trying to get clicks and less focused on the Trump reaction and viewing that as a happy side effect, a happy coincidence. It's a click-driven time period these days where people just want the attention and the eyeballs and almost, I think, approach things with a let the chips fall where they may afterwards dynamic.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And that is on the tariffs and the general initial question of what do I think about it? Look, I think there are definitely instances where the United States has been maybe taken advantage of as a bridge too far, but certainly has gotten the lesser side of trade deals and where I think addressing some of those imbalances and double standards that have existed made sense and was prudent.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
I think the unpredictability of tariffs and some of the unintended consequences of that, whether it's on the stock market or on domestic jobs or pricing, inflation, et cetera, I think is unfortunate. And so look, as a general statement, I would like to have cohesive plans, whether it's on a sports team I cheer for, a business, the firm I work for, I'm a partner in, or with government.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Having a cohesive plan and then moving towards that plan, to me, has value. If I felt truly in my heart of hearts that the instituting of tariffs and then retrading and then pulling back and then reinstitution, if I thought that was part of a grand plan to get from point A to point B, I'd feel a little bit more confident in it than
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
where I think some of it is very much reactionary and feeling things out and trying to assess how bad things might be or how much you might be able to apply pressure. So I think trying to focus on trade and trying to correct some of the imbalances, broadly speaking, is good strategy.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
I think having a cohesive game plan for doing that would be better strategy, and I'm hoping to see a bit more of that going forward.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
No, I think that's right. It's going to be trying to figure out exactly what we can accomplish, and I think from his standpoint – what he can sell as a win and as being accretive to the American people. And I think as things progress, that's going to be more difficult to sell if things like the deficit are not and debt spending are not addressed.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And I think there's been lots of consternation on both sides of the aisle regarding the budget and And I think things like the tariffs are not going to be a one-size-fits-all solution there. So I think, really, it's got to be figuring out a negotiated outcome that has at least incremental wins for the country.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
But just as importantly, I think it's recognizing tariffs aren't a cure-all to the financial problems that exist. And a lot of that is going to have to come down to addressing spending and also strongly thinking about taxation in the country as well. which are much more complicated discussions.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Yeah, look, I think my biggest thought on it really comes down to Elon and how he's personally reacting. I've seen the tweets that you're referencing or maybe the X's, I don't know what I'm supposed to call them these days, but I find Elon Musk endlessly fascinating because I think he is
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
On the one hand, an incredibly smart, capable person with an incredible ability to understand big picture issues and to think about them and to think about the future of the country, the planet, etc.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And then I also see him sometimes as a guy who just wants to get on Twitter and post memes and troll people, which, frankly, I think should be beneath him relative to his wealth and intellectual capabilities. And the fact that he could be spending his time making the world a better place rather than, you know, trolling to live.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And so I find him to be endlessly fascinating and puzzling, et cetera, because I have a generally high perspective of his capabilities and his intellect. And he's a guy who three years ago, four years ago, I would have said to you is the kind of guy who could be in charge of solving macro problems like global warming, climate change, and trying to help the planet and sustainability.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And I don't see that now as much as someone who is interested in the attention as much as everything else. And I personally find that a bit disappointing because, again, I think his healing and capabilities are so incredibly high. And I'd like to see him get back to it. So it'll be interesting. You know, he's taken a foray into politics.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
with Doge and his active involvement in the Trump campaign and being involved with President Trump's administration. I think based on recent tweets and some of what we've seen, that seems to be dissipating a little bit. And he's clearly shown a capacity to pivot in his perspectives and approach. And it may be that we're on the eve of
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Another such pivot that might address and correct some of what I just raised. But I mean, my main reaction to him more than anything else is I hold him in high regard in terms of his capabilities. And I have hope that he gets back to more of a core focus on things that are creative and beneficial to the planet.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
rather than pounding his chest and sending out a constant message of how much money he has and that he doesn't care what other people are thinking about.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Yeah, I mean, I don't know that Elon being more engaged in Tesla at this point is necessarily beneficial, because I think a lot of the problems for Tesla are at this point, Elon caused, which is unfortunate.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And it's not through his operation of the business so much as just, you know, there are aspects of day-to-day life in the United States that I don't think it's radical to say, sticking with the theme of keywords, that are somewhat tribal in nature. And politics certainly fits very heavily into that category. And so where, you know, one of Haley's uncles who's
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
A kind, smart person who drives a Tesla every couple of weeks posts his long explanatory Facebook post or meta post or whatever the heck it's called about how he drove a Tesla before Elon, quote unquote, went crazy. And he's got a 75 paragraph essay justifying his choice of vehicle. And that at this point, it's too expensive for him to get out from that decision. You know, I read things like that.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And I think it creates a real risk for Tesla as a company because there's a whole bunch of people that are here that are existing customers or would-be customers who are going to ultimately refuse to buy the vehicle, either because they don't agree with what one of the principles of the company stands for, or because they're worried that by driving the car, they're communicating an agreement that they don't want to, and they're going to have folks, you know,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
key their car or do other things that they don't want to deal with. I think when you have those forces posed against the business, I think that there's real risk because the ability to sell cars and the ability to unload used Teslas is obviously being severely impacted. I think people are fairly dug in on their concerns on that front.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
What that means, it may be as simple as an additional pivot from Elon in a different direction that cures those particular problems. But I think absent something changing, there's a bit of a spiral there. And when the fundamental core business is selling vehicles, and it's become harder to sell vehicles for political reasons, that doesn't bode well for the company.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
And I don't think there's a quick fix.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
In any event, David Pivnik- By the way, that should be part of their marketing campaign. People in France don't want to drive our cars. They should lean into that. I think it makes them a more appealing brand in the United States. That should be part of their platform.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Trump, Tariffs, TACO, & Tesla with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 6-4-25
Great keeping up. Thanks for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
The ratings are through the roof and people are talking about hockey in a way that basically never happens. So as you can tell, I'm pretty pumped about it. And I have to tip my cap to the NHL because they, like I said, consistently get lampooned for doing the wrong thing and not growing the sport.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
And they absolutely, you know, this was a slam dunk or a great slap shot as the case would be very well done. In terms of the game coming up, look, I mean, clearly the U.S.-Canada hockey rivalry, so to speak, which I think has become much more of a real rivalry in recent years.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Canadians love to point to the historic records, but it's starting to narrow over the last few years, and particularly at the world junior level where the U.S. team continues to have increased success and the Canadian team has had a couple rough years in the last few go-rounds. It's great to see. This is going to be more of a rivalry and more of an even rivalry in the future. I think that the U.S.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
team coming into the tournament, I think we talked about this before, I said I thought they had the best defense and also the best goaltending. That has certainly held up as the tournament has progressed, and I thought Canada's forwards were the strongest defenders. which they have sort of gone back and forth depending on the game. They look pretty anemic versus the U.S. on Saturday.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
So I think tomorrow's game is going to be a great game. I think McAvoy being out on defense for the U.S. hurts quite a bit. And I'm expecting Canada to come out pretty inspired, even on the road in Boston, and to get the win tomorrow night. But I expect it to be a pretty tight and exciting game to watch.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
I have some inner conflict, actually. I will say I like. Both teams and, you know, if they were playing anyone else, it'd be easy to know who I was cheering for. This game's a little bit tough. It's Kachuk. You were sort of close. I think you managed to mispronounce it two different ways. But, you know, you're in the ballpark, which is good. And I do think, you know, for them...
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Playing for the same country their father played for, and obviously their dad, Keith Kachuk, had a great career, you know, makes a lot of sense. And those guys are kind of the heart and soul of the U.S. team. I'm sure you've seen, you know, they were texting, the two of them, you know, Matt Kachuk and Brady were texting with J.T. Miller and basically agreed before the game.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
they were going to drop the myths and get a fight going to sort of kick things off. So I view that less as a critique on the booing and the anthem and more on them rallying, you know, rallying behind the stars and stripes and wanting to send the right message in a big game for their team, which, you know, that's a, it's a fun part of hockey, whether you like fighting in the game or not.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
And so I'm glad that they kicked it off in that way, in terms of your more political question and, I mean, look, we've talked about President Trump's statements on Canada before. I think much of it is hyperbole that's not likely to lead anywhere.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
But, you know, it's not ideal to create distaste in the eyes of, you know, a close friend, not just a neighboring country, but one of the greatest, you know, relationships between two countries, I think, in the world in terms of, you know, a peaceful, unprotected, you know, border, you know, close trade relationship, close partnership on a lot of fronts.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
So I think it's unfortunate from that standpoint. But I view that more through the lens of how actual items like tariffs are going to play out rather than trying to evaluate it based on, you know, whether or not the anthem's getting booed. I think if the crowd in Montreal is wants to boo the anthem. You know, it is what it is. There's plenty of things about Montreal that I think warrants booing.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
It's a great question. I think Montreal, where most of the people also speak English and they have tried to participate in Canada more generally, is clearly part of Canada. I think there are parts of Quebec that do fancy themselves as being separate, which is why, you know, Quebec has periodically voted separately. to separate from the country.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
So, you know, that's never passed, and I don't think secession will happen, but it's, you know, different parts of Quebec inspire different levels of affection amongst Canadians.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
So I appreciate the implicit insult in there. I'm not sure if I think I'm honored to be called blue collar. I don't think I get that description a lot, although I'm a little offended. You think my disdain for the Quebec was because I don't feel smart enough to deal with them. I assure you that's not the particular problem there, but appreciate where you were going with the question.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
I mean, look, amongst the various provinces, I don't think there's a legitimate debate that Ontario is the best province. I recognize other provinces might incorrectly contest that point, or I guess citizens of other provinces. But I just think objectively, you know, Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia are the three profitable provinces that sort of drive the rest of the country.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
And I think Ontario and British Columbia are clearly the best of the provinces if one were ranking best. such things. So, you know, with that in mind, I'm not going to stoop to trying to dignify your question about how Quebec might feel or whether I should feel sufficient for Quebec.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
yeah look great question love to talk about it and i want to start by just i want to touch on what you said at the beginning which is the nhl got something right which i think is something we can all be as hockey fans be excited about and also somewhat shocked because the nhl constantly steps on its own feet and falls all over itself to do the absolutely worst thing for growing the sport
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
So first of all, if we're going to compare something to Texas, I think it would be Alberta. I think that's where you were trying to go with the oil. I think you've demonstrated you're confusing your Canadian state.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
I will also note, I'm thrilled before I answer your question, that you didn't ask me to rank the remaining Canadian states because we're the Canadian provinces, I apologize, because while I can list them all, once you've got past the first five states, The rest kind of just get ranked together. I think there's just a group at some point. And I'll take the slings and arrows.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
If you have any Nova Scotian or Newfoundland listeners, they can follow up with you directly.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
I wouldn't use the terms flyover country or irrelevant. I'm simply stating they don't compare anything. to Ontario. I view that as objective fact. I think they're wonderful places to live if that's where you want to live. I think going to Dalhousie and Halifax for university could be a lovely place to go study for a few years. I have nothing against those places.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
No different than I have nothing against the great state of Kansas. I just don't want to live there and periodically mock one of our colleagues who used to live there. There's nothing wrong with
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
London, England, clearly.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Didn't see that coming. No hesitation on that one either. London, Ontario, lovely place, but clearly not the real London. I mean, that's a softball.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Or the incomparable state of Iowa. That's a tough one. There's a few states that I think would fit in this characterization, but I'm going to go with the lovely province of Saskatchewan.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
T'Chuk. The T is silent.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
and building the brand of hockey in the NHL and gaining popularity in the States. And they finally did something so right and they deserve credit.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
I am certain nobody wants to have injuries. I don't view it as sort of regulated fighting. I mean, look, they're throwing punches and you're doing it on skates and with the risk of getting thrown headfirst to the ice. So I think the guys in the NHL and the guys in this tournament all have terrific balance. And even the elite scorers have had some physical confrontations or fights at some point.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Sidney Crosby's dropped the mitts probably three times. So they have a general sense of what they're doing, and I certainly don't think there's any intent to injure as those fights go on. But, look, you get punched in the face, bare knuckles, you know, several times in a row, it's going to hurt one way or the other. So it's a real fight.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Happy to be on. Thanks for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
And I love the fact that, you know, at the beginning of last week, right after the Super Bowl, there was a lot of media discussion about how stupid the NHL was for, you know, canceling games effectively for two weeks right in the lull after football and not capitalizing on that gap in the sports scene. And instead, this four nations thing has just been a smash success.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
in a Supreme Court case where he noted that he thought it would be interesting, that there might be a challenge to the constitutionality and whether whistleblowers could proceed with claims. And I think that invited a lot of litigation.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
And Zafirov is a Middle District of Florida case where the judge, who's a President Trump appointee from his first term, granted judgment for the defendant and found that the Ketan provisions were not constitutional. And that case has since been appealed. And the briefing is now completed, as of about a month ago, before the 11th Circuit.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
There's been amicus briefs that were filed from a variety of constituents, including the Department of Justice and other government officials, as well as amicus briefs on the other side. So both sides have briefed this very extensively. And it'll be interesting, with the 11th Circuit weighing in on constitutionality.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
And I expect fully that the issue will make its way to the Supreme Court and likely get taken up by the Supreme Court. And that would have a massive impact on False Blames Act litigation generally and specifically on whistleblower litigation. So that's something that the briefing was completed in the first five months, first four months really of this year.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
And it's certainly something I've been focused on and looking into it and will have a big impact on work that I'm participating in and representing clients in going forward. And then I always monitor what DOJ is focused on and where some of the key litigation efforts are going as well.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
I think there is. I think that the general concept here is under the Constitution, based on the Appointments Clause and Care Clause, There are certain authorities that are limited to the executive and where people have to be appointed to represent the government appropriately.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
In this instance, the key to supervision sort of circumvent that and had whistleblowers with no basis or standing other than self-election, self-determining that they're going to file a lawsuit, coming in and taking over that. And while the government has the ability to investigate and intervene,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
in cases where it declines to do so, and the DOJ is not running the case, you're left with private litigants making their own decisions. And so I think there's already, to my mind, as you pointed out, the False Claims Act is initially a Civil War enacted statute. To my mind, it is not intended to cover or was not intended to cover the wide array of purported wrongs that it currently covers.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
I think it's already been taken beyond its intended utility. And particularly in the healthcare context, I think the False Claims Act is an inappropriate and overly blunt object for hammering out, in many instances, what is hyper-technical violations rather than sort of black and white fraud.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
It was more intended to do things like billing for services not rendered or intentional upcoding, billing for treating dead people versus you know, any allegation of regulatory non-compliance can lead to potential liability under the False Claims Act with this heavy statutory penalty scheme, so long as the non-compliance is purportedly material.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
So there's a lot of ability for folks to pursue non-fraudulent, at least, you know, as you or I or our listeners would contemplate fraud, conduct that doesn't really fit in that rubric, but can fit under the act. And in healthcare,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
you know, where the statutory penalties right now are, you know, into the five digits per claim, you know, you could be looking at a situation where you build improperly for an E&M code If you got paid $150, give or take, for the evaluation management service, but your liability, if you fraudulently build that code, could be $25,000, it's somewhat outsized and nonsensical, frankly, in proportion.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
I think there's already some practical and policy issues with the statute, which is not can't amount to me saying fraud is fine, don't worry about it. It's more saying there are appropriate ways to monitor it. And there's a big difference between fraud and regulatory noncompliance getting lumped in with fraud.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
And so taking that framework and then applying the fact that, you know, with some limited exceptions, anyone can bring these claims on behalf of the government. I do think the constitutionality concerns are well taken.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
I think if it was fair to be non-constitutional, the way it would practically work would be whistleblowers wouldn't be able to prosecute the claims. So it might not prevent whistleblowers from asserting claims, but it would certainly leave claims where the government declined to intervene and take over the prosecution in a situation where those claims would become
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
unconstitutional and therefore barred and subject to judgment or dismissal.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
Yeah, so you're right on with the numbers. In any given year, it's in that 20% to 25% ballpark that the government intervenes. Now, it isn't necessarily the case that that the remainder would all go out if it was fair and unconstitutional, because part of what might happen is, you know, it's possible DOJ would intervene more frequently. There might be other steps that were taken to protect cases.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
I do think there's a significant number of cases, some of which, you know, unfortunately for my clients, like I've had multiple cases where I've represented clients who really didn't do anything wrong, full stop, period. There was no
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
merit to it, but they are in a position where it is incredibly expensive to defend these cases and incredibly risky in case you have a judgment against because of that penalty scheme. There is a lot of cases I think annually that end up getting settled for relatively low amounts because people are ultimately concerned about the outside liability. I think a lot of those cases
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
Sure, absolutely, Scott. Appreciate you having me on. You know, Business-wise, day-to-day, as you alluded to, I spend a lot of my time and energy defending False Claims Act cases, representing a wide range of providers, health systems, managed care insurers, as well as private equity funds. I often am focused on issues in that space.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
would fall away, and I think, frankly, very much appropriately so. I think the bigger cases, both in terms of dollars and targets and the risk, and particularly where the conduct is egregious, the DOJ would be picking up anyway. And so those would not be falling away. And again, I don't view it as one where someone could get away
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
With wrongdoing, I view it more as avoiding improperly incentivizing people to bring claims knowing that there might not be anything there, but they're likely to be able to shake out a decent settlement if they can survive a motion to dismiss.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, the numbers fluctuate year to year over the last five to 10 years, the number in total government fraud recoveries, it is typically in the $3 to $5 billion range. There's some exceptions slightly higher than the $5 billion mark, some exceptions that are in the $2 to $3 billion range, but that $3 to $5 billion
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
range has been where the recoveries have been for most of the last several years, probably dating back at this point, the better part of a decade. Most years, as you alluded to, the overwhelming majority of those dollars are in cases where the government intervenes. So again, the government's intervening one in four, one in five
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
cases in every one in four one in five cases and they're recovering you know almost always north of 80 percent and usually north of 90 percent um there's one year in the last you know decade that was a notable exception where there was about 70 percent uh and that was largely because there happened to be a a healthily into the nine digits settlement in a non-intervene case which is
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
very much the exception, not the rule. But by and large, the government's recovering the heavy majority of its dollars from the small minority of cases in which it has decided to intervene. And then from an industry standpoint, it fluctuates year to year, but healthcare is almost always the source of the majority of
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
of cases, it's usually in 50% to 70% of the filings, as well as the dollars, are in the healthcare space. And that includes healthcare services, managed care, life sciences, et cetera. And then the next two industries that get covered in a meaningful way are defense contracting and the mortgage industry.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
Thank you for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
One of them that is particularly notable to me right now is an 11th Circuit appeal in what's known as the Zafirop case. That is focusing on whether or not the False Claims Act and specifically its key TAM provisions allowing whistleblowers to bring lawsuits on behalf of the government is constitutional.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
False Claims Cases with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 5-29-25
There's been many challenges to the constitutionality of the statute, but it hasn't been determined by the Supreme Court or really resolved with any finality. A couple of years ago in 2023, Justice Thomas issued a dissenting opinion
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
But I think in terms of the market and what the Fed chairman and others are saying, I think the biggest takeaway for me is I'm in my low 40s and unfortunate that I have a
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
fortunate and unfortunate, I guess, but I have a long runway to retirement such that I'm not actively monitoring and losing my mind over the market day to day, which I recognize is something I have the benefit of and others don't. But I think there are, you know, the market is going to be impacted and continue to be impacted by uncertainty. That's just part of what happens with the stock market.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
And so as long as there is a level of uncertainty, whether it's relative to tariffs, rates, international relations, the potential for a looming recession. There's enough headwinds that I think it's going to be tough for the market to become fully stable right now. But I don't know that there's any sort of magic solution.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
I don't think it's a situation where just don't worry about it is the answer, nor do I think it's one where overall panic is the right answer either. But again, easier for me to say than for someone who's approaching retirement or currently retired and is looking at those funds in their retirement account more actively and concerned.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
And in terms of President Trump as a master negotiator versus something else, I mean, I think like with many things, he's just unpredictable. And I don't think there is a simple answer I think some of it might be grand strategy. I think some of it might be power plays and feeling out how it will work. And I think that lack of cohesion isn't helpful, but I think in some ways it's strategic as well.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
First of all, if you were not trying to call Zach Levine a cancer, you did a very poor job not calling him a cancer. I think in the Bulls' case,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
They had a lot of younger talent and guys who, with the ball in their hands, Josh Giddey and Kobe White, had a lot more to offer than they were allowed to show while Zach Levine was running things and was getting the ball and taking the majority of the shots. And so in their instance, I think it is less a function of Zach Levine not being good or being a problem
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
and more of the young guys the Bulls have, I think have some real potential and had some unlocked ability that they were able to get unlocked and help. I do think it's interesting that with Sacramento, who is a weird team because they traded De'Aaron Fox and looked like sellers, and then they added Levine, they sort of stumbled down the stretch.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
They haven't looked great over the back half of the season. Their record is actually worse than the Bulls since the trade deadline, and I think they're going to lose to the Mavericks tonight and get eliminated, although Kyrie not playing and being out for the year doesn't help the Mavs, whereas I think the Bulls are going to beat the Heat tonight. We'll see if I'm right on that, but I think
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
The bottom line is they have a lot of young talent that's exciting for them to build around. And I think giving those kids a chance was incredibly helpful. I'm not sure it's as much a criticism or a shot at Zach Levine so much as just having the talent available and providing young kids the opportunity to shine and them stepping up and doing exactly that.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
I think most – on the latter part, I mean, I think bandwagon fans of big market teams around the country are probably cheering for them. And I get lots of jokes how because I'm a Cowboy fan, I must love the Yankees and Lakers, both of whom I hate. But putting that aside, I think the vast majority of fans are not cheering for the Lakers.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
And the short answer to your first question is no, I don't think they can win it all. I don't think they have enough defensive talent on that roster to in their role players, and I don't think they have enough of an interior presence in the paint, both rebounding and defending the paint, in order to win. So I think they're capable of beating any team in the West, other than maybe the Thunder.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
I don't think the West is having that strong of a year, but I don't think the Lakers could beat any of the top four or five teams in the Eastern Conference, and I don't think they can get by the Thunder. So I think this is a year where to sort of feel out the process, get familiar with each other, maybe win a playoff round or two at most.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
And then I think it's a function of rounding out the roster and adding some bigs in the offseason to try and give it a real shot next year with LeBron and Luka leading the way.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
It is no longer the forum. They play in the Bell Center. I have not watched a game there, although I've been there a couple of times where we debated it, but I have not actually been to a game there. I'm sure it's a great place. at the Bell Center to watch a game these days.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
From what I've seen on TV, it certainly seems like a very lively and engaged and knowledgeable crowd, but I'm sure it's not as good as the old form used to be, the same as the United Center is great, but I can't imagine it compares to what Chicago Stadium was like in terms of crowd noise, presence, and impact.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
That's a great question, Ed. It's an easy answer for me. I haven't been in a couple years, but unless something meaningful has changed in the last couple years, by far what was Assembly Hall in Champaign when I was in law school and is now, I believe, State Farm Arena. But the Illini Basketball Stadium is by far my favorite place to watch a game.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
Not a professional sport, but my absolute love the team, love the stadium, and love being down in Champaign. So that's an easy one for me.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
I mean, I have Blackhawks season tickets, too. So the United Center is definitely more of a home stadium. But I spend equal, similar amounts of time in both. And for basketball, certainly Fiserv Forum in Milwaukee is my home stadium.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
No, and I don't. And I'm scared to ask.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
Thanks for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Market Uncertainty, Leadership Lessons, and Competitive Dynamics with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 4-19-25
Perfect. Thank you, Scott. I think it's an interesting question, and I'm going to answer the substance in a second. I think All aspects of that question are somewhere in the middle ground between the extremes you described. But I want to just note that I'm not sure how you possibly started that question with rat battles of history on YouTube, which feels very far afield from the rest of it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Thanks for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
to push back on the notion that it was just a territory of the United States. And I think it actually really helped Mark Cardy coming in and taking over the liberal leadership and then, frankly, winning the election and becoming prime minister. And I think, you know, the repercussions of that remain to be seen. I didn't find the meeting at the White House to be all that noteworthy.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I know people have been getting their snippets on the comments about you know, how important a trade partner is, but I certainly don't think President Trump is undercutting the importance of Canada as a trade partner so much as trying to make sure that no trade partners are taking advantage.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I think there's room to disagree on how that's being handled, but I don't think it's intended to be creating friction with Canada. I think that, like other things, has been an indirect consequence, and I think the main thing is it did have an impact on the Canadian election.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Well, I mean, the first thing is you and everybody else should be watching more than just snippets.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
playoff hockey is just the best I'm very excited to talk about that but it's really great and you're absolutely right this year there's been a ton of great comebacks a ton of overtimes just really really fun playoffs to watch and it's been great watching it with my kids particularly my sons who keep lamenting how much they want to go see a Blackhawks playoff game and how fun it will be and hopefully that will not be too far away into the future but the playoffs have been great I think
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I believe we'll see how this plays out, but I believe the Leafs' annual collapse starts in about, give or take, let me just look at the clock, but in about five hours, 48 minutes, I believe they will start walking their way out of the playoffs and the Panthers are going to crush them tonight and carry on. I think Florida has a good chance to win it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I am personally hoping that Connor McDavid gets his first Stanley Cup out in Edmonton. I think he's a phenomenal player and a lot of fun to watch. And while the Oilers' defense is mediocre and their goaltending is not even that good, I'm not sure that their offense and power play isn't good enough to potentially get it done this year.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And I think the Dallas Stars, if they get healthy with Heiskanen and Robertson coming back, they could be a real contender as well. But I think it's been a very high-paced, lots of scoring in the playoffs this year, a little bit more open than is typical and a lot of fun to watch. I thought the draft lottery, you know, first of all, I thought the actual process was kind of confusing.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
It was the first time they'd gone to the live drawing, and I think a lot of people were confused. I really wanted the Hawks to have a top two pick, mainly because I think Michael Misa is a center that really would have fit well. I am skeptical that he will fall to pick three, but I'm hopeful that he does.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And if not, I think the Hawks are going to end up going with either Porter Martone, who's a big power forward from Ontario, or or Anton Frondell, a Swedish center. I think both of them fit different needs on the roster and would be very good additions. And I'll be happy if Misa falls or if we get one of those two.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
There are some rumblings of a couple other names that the Hawks are rumored to like and would be sort of off-the-board picks, and I'm hoping they avoid those. We've got lots of assets that they want to trade back up into the first round and pick someone else who would be a reach at three. But ultimately, a pick three – we should be getting a good player.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And I think the bigger thing to watch is I expect the Blackhawks to be relatively meaningful players in free agency this summer and trying to snag a couple of strong wingers to really give Conor Bedard and Frank Nazer more talent to play with and start pushing towards the playoffs. Maybe not next year, but the year after. So I think they could be in on guys like Mitch Marder if he hits the market.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Nikolai Ilu is out of Winnipeg. and Sam Bennett. And frankly, we've got 30 million in cap space. So it's time to start spending it. We've got lots of picks the next few years. Let's start putting some talent on the ice and moving this thing forward.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
it is decidedly undecided. So Anders Sorensen was the interim coach, and I respect what he's done, which is basically come out and say whether or not he's the head coach, he likes the organization and wants to be involved and is willing to stay on under someone else in the future, which I think is great. I think he'd be well-suited, frankly, as an assistant coach.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I don't necessarily think he's the right guy for the head gig. I think the prime target is that every Blackhawks fan that's sort of paying attention to this wanted was David Carl, who's the coach at the University of Denver. He's probably the most sought-after head coach candidate in the world and has built an incredibly successful program and development pipeline in Denver.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Unfortunately, and I get his decision-making, but he ultimately interviewed for the Hawks job, the Anaheim Ducks job, and a couple others, and made the cut that he was going to stay in college, and he signed an extension. in Denver and with the University of Denver and said he wants to keep, you know, his family where they are and not move around and have stability.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
So I wish him nothing but the best with that. But I think, I think the Hawks had a lot of eggs in that particular basket and were very focused on him from a development standpoint. And now I think they're sort of back to the drawing board and looking at some other options. So I don't really know where it's going to go. It seems to be a slow process.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Yeah, I mean, look, the U.S.-Canadian relationship is at an interesting point in time, I think, You know, as a general statement, I would say I think the majority of Canadians have been displeased with the sort of 51st state rhetoric. I suspect, like many things, President Trump is saying that a little bit tongue in cheek to get a rise, including, you know, with the references to Governor Trudeau.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And again, I suspect in part that's because they have David Carl and maybe Mike Sullivan, the former Penguins coach as sort of prime targets who ended up either not moving or going elsewhere. And now they're sort of recalibrated.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Yeah, that was great because you finished that by saying I'm watching them closer than you do right after you were talking up the Timberwolves and Anthony Edwards, who got routed last night. And Edwards was absolutely dreadful, missed every shot he took in the first half, and had no jump shots made in the whole game until about two minutes ago.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Look, the first thing is I really dislike the Indiana Pacers other than Pascal Siakam. who I will always love as a former Raptor. But I think the Pacers look damn good. I mean, they beat the Bucs, and it wasn't just due to injuries. They absolutely earned that series win. They're beating the Cavaliers and heading back to Indiana up 2-0.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And at this point, I think the Pacers have a legitimate chance to come out of the East. But just like hockey, there's been a lot of good competitive games, lots of comebacks, 20-point comebacks, 12-point comebacks. Seems to be the season for it. So I think the Thunder Nuggets is a very fun series. I thought the Thunder were going to absolutely crush them.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
But the Nuggets came back from double digits down in the fourth quarter the other day and they won. And I think the Timberwolves have a very real chance to come out of the West. But they lost yesterday to Golden State in game one. So they've given up home court advantage now. And they lost the game where Steph Curry lost.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
missed basically three quarters of the game leaving with an injury so I think the Warriors have a little something going with Jimmy Butler you know looking a little bit reinvigorated and Buddy Heald which is you know a name from the past that has not really worked out as intended in the NBA but was a heck of a college player he kind of looks like college Buddy Heald right now and is really playing well so right now I still think the Thunder will end up coming out of
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
the West, and it will end up being the Celtics or the Pacers out of the East. But the Pacers and Timberwolves are looking much more threatening than I think people anticipated coming in. And again, a lot of young stars playing good high-level basketball.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I think the NBA, you know, the ratings are not where they want them to be, but I think there's a lot of young and exciting talent in the league for people to watch if they want to pay attention to it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Yes. I mean, I think it's all of that. I think the TV deals are a headache. I think when you have a series like Milwaukee versus Indiana that was blacked out heavily in the Indiana State market and in Wisconsin – you're not doing yourselves any favors. Having a lot of games on NBA TV, which I have, but lots of people don't, isn't great.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
But I also think it's a big problem where a lot of the teams that are really strong right now are not in the heaviest market, although the Knicks and Celtics are playing each other, and that's an entertaining series that I think will have decent ratings, but a lot of the games are not. I think they've got major problems with how they schedule the games. There are so many games being played with
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
Eastern or Midwest-based teams that have the late-night start, which I think makes things really difficult. I took my kids to an 8.30 start central time game last week in Milwaukee, and it's just a tough time to take kids to games, let alone to have them watching on TV at home. So I don't think that's helped. And then the last thing is the stars.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
But I think it's an interesting dynamic because, frankly, the tariff discussions and the sort of what I view as probably relatively lighthearted,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
I think people still like and are interested in Seth Curry, but LeBron's already been eliminated, and Giannis has been eliminated. Doncic has been eliminated. So a lot of the bigger stars are not currently playing.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And some of the superstars that are still playing, you know, Shegel, just Alexander or Nikola Jokic are terrific players, but don't necessarily draw the same number of eyeballs as LeBron did or Kobe once did or Michael Jordan certainly used to.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
They are quite active. It does not, I mean, I do think you're right. People, myself included, weren't sure how things would play out. And I think the DOJ has been actively pursuing cases. And a lot of the areas where it looks like you know, resources have been reallocated.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
There's been a lot of focus in reallocating of those resources into healthcare enforcement, which, as you know, and folks who have listened to us chat before, that's very much where a lot of my efforts are focused on the defense side.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
jibes by President Trump ended up actually making a difference in the Canadian election, where I think the Liberal Party had been widely disdained for a long time, and everybody in Canada, and I use everybody loosely, but a substantial proportion of Canadians were ready to move on from Justin Trudeau, and the Liberals were in rough shape, and I think the country kind of galvanized and rallied together with Canadian pride
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
So it's made for interesting developments and a few interesting cases that I'm certainly following closely, but I think the DOJ will continue to be active, notwithstanding the a new administration taking over earlier this year. And if anything, it'll be something more of a reallocation of priorities.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
And one of the, what looks to be continuing focal points will be healthcare fraud enforcement, which, you know, is something that, you know, I'll continue to work on and push back on on behalf of my clients where appropriate.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Canada, Hockey & Healthcare Enforcement with David Pivnick 5-10-25
He's not going to win MVP. I think Jokic is going to win it again. He's going to come in second, I'm pretty sure, and then Giannis third, but it's Shea Gilgis-Alexander. I would think a doctor such as yourself, Dr. Becker, newly minted, would have known that, but it's Shea Gilgis-Alexander.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
It was a little bit of a challenge when you said you might be asking me about the worst advice. But two things come to mind, and one of them is pretty well-trod advice that people dispense all the time, but I think it's not great, which is good things come to those who wait.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And then the second thing that came to mind, which is probably less given, but I've certainly heard a variety of times over the years, and maybe I hear it more than the average, is just try and fit in. Don't stand out. And I think those are just both generally bad pieces of advice in some ways for the same reasons. But, you know, the notion of good things come to those who wait.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
I mean, first of all, I think that is an inherent excuse. And the people offering that advice are often offering it because they're about to tell you no, just something that you're looking to accomplish or somewhere you're trying to go. And so right off the bat, I think it's a bit of a,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
huge piece of advice where it's usually being offered by someone who has a vested interest in the recipients of that advice waiting.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
Yeah, no, and I hit the head on that example, and that is an unfortunate one. But I think it's also just generally, if you have things in mind, if you've got targets and goals, You need to be realistic about it. You can't just decide I'm going to accomplish, I'm going to make a billion dollars and then be disappointed the next day.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
There's not a shortcut here, but the general notion of sitting around idle or waiting and just maintaining the status quo and hoping things develop, I just think is poor advice. In a career context, taking initiative, showing confidence, that you can be a leader, that you can take on meaningful tasks, that you can continue to progress is going to help you then progress.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
I think there's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy in either direction there. If you keep waiting, you're going to just keep waiting. And if you try and take action, I think you're much more likely to accomplish those goals. And I think the second part of the other advice that I mentioned, bad advice, is the case would be in terms of just just try and blend in. You don't want to stand out.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
I think people hear that kind of advice at a corporate setting all the time. I've only worked at one of the law firms, but I felt that law firm, certainly in the office of the department I was in at that point, which was two decades ago now, so I'm sure it's much different, but I felt like they expected a cookie-cutter associate. And that's not me. That's never been me in anything I've done.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And I think it really put a ceiling for me on what I would be able to accomplish there. Because I was so focused on trying to look like everybody else. And I'm not like everybody else. And so coming to McGuire Woods, and frankly, working with you and Jeff Clark and others, who basically said, you know, we've got to work, but let you go run it, do it as you see fitting and trusted me
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
to navigate client relationships, navigate opposing counsel, navigate matters, allowed me to figure out how to do things well my own way, how to manage clients, how to interact with people, with judges, with opposing counsel, et cetera. But if I was just spending half my time trying to figure out how to be like everybody else, I would never have figured out how to be great at who I am.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And it's a whole hell of a lot easier To be yourself and to be true to yourself every day.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And so I really think that unlocks a lot in my career and my potential, frankly, as an attorney, but also in terms of developing business and building a practice when I was able to recognize I can succeed based on my merit and by being me rather than just trying to shoehorn myself into what other people are looking for.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
Not that sort of global in application. I know several years ago, someone advised you, you could beat me in a race. I think that was poor advice and landed badly for you, but that's not necessarily applicable to most of the listeners. So it's less of a global comment than a specific example.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
I completely agree with that. And as we're already, and it seems incredibly early to me, but we're already starting the interview process for next year's, the 2026 summer associate class. And I think your point about resumes applies just as well to law students and to folks interviewing for jobs in a professional setting where
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
having six different associations or clubs or activities or eight different or 10 different on a resume, but where it just says, you know, member of is going to be far less impressive to me than one or two where you were the president of X society and were able to speak about what you actually did in that role and how you helped grow the organization versus just I signed my name up or wrote a $50 check.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And I think your point is well taken. in the professional setting too. I mean, I joke about myself all the time, frankly, that I'm not necessarily independently important to the firm or to others, but I'm very important to many of the people who are very important. And I think you hit the nail on the head there.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
I think I carry my own weight just fine, but for the three to five top people in healthcare and private equity, by putting myself in a position to be their go-to litigator, I've made myself very valuable to the firm and our clients as well.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
And I think that is good general advice of figuring out who's going to help, who you can be valuable to, and in turn will return that favor and be valuable back in supporting you, I think has a lot of value. And it's a lot easier to do that when you're talking about three to five people versus 10 to 12.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
Yeah, sadly, we're skipping the This year, they didn't make our rounds. We are, however, interviewing at University of Illinois, which is very much the Harvard of Champaign. So it's not quite Harvard itself, but all the same, quite impressive. And, you know, I'll still take my law school credentials over yours. So I've got that going for me.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
David Pivnick on the Worst Professional Advice He’s Ever Received 5-23-25
Sure. I mean, the two things that come to mind, it's a weird question, and I appreciate you having me on and following kind words about me after talking about your 7 million impressions and all your other accolades, which outshine all. But usually people, as you said, ask about what's great advice, what advice would you pass on.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I have some loyalty to the Bills, having grown up in Toronto and a lot of my friends are Bills fans. But when the Bills got the ball back with three minutes to go, you know, I wasn't sitting there certain Josh Allen would get the win. But if the Chiefs are down three on Sunday and they get the ball back,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I'd be happy to bet anyone, whatever they want, that the Chiefs are winning that game because I just don't see Mahomes not getting it done when the Chiefs are down and the game's on the line. And so with Mahomes, who I think is the best player in the game, I think they're going to win. I do think Saquon Barkley is a major difference maker for the Eagles. I don't think he should be taken lightly.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And what he's done this year is frankly incredible. But between the fact that I just think so highly of Mahomes and I frankly hate the Eagles. So maybe there's a bit of my heart in it as well. I am certainly pulling for the Chiefs and frankly think the Chiefs are going to win. And to your question about, you know, where Mahomes fits.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
in the greatest of all time discussion, I think the gap between Tom Brady and him is much closer than many people would like to acknowledge. And if Mahomes gets it done on Sunday, so he's got four titles and the first ever Super Bowl III, Pete, I think those scales are starting to look pretty even and Mahomes is likely going to pass it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I think the weirdest part of the trade is how Anthony Davis is getting treated. And I think your lead in here is sort of emblematic of that, where it took until the third or fourth time you mentioned the trade before you even said his name. And I kind of feel like Anthony Davis is being treated like he's Bill Cartwright.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I mean, statistically, if you look at their first, you know, eight years in the league, 10 years in the league, whatever Mahomes has been in the league, he's already far surpassed Brady statistically. It's not even close. The league's a little different. Maybe he's got some better talent, but it's not close.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
So if he starts stacking up the wins just as well, and he's already got three, and this could be a three-peated four in a very short tenure, I think it's hard not to have him legitimately in that discussion.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Critically important. I think it is critically important. Coaching, just like having good executives, good leadership in a successful business is important. It's not the whole ballgame. You need to have a good team, but it's critically important. Coaching in the NFL is absolutely important. Some of it is just the confidence factor.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Some of it is understanding that the guy on the sideline making decisions is going to have your back, is going to make good decisions, is not going to cost your team the game with questionable decision-making. I think going out there every week and fully trusting in your coach is critical for a team. So even beyond the talent, just having a coach that instills that confidence
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I think is major, and I think the Chiefs have that with Andy Reid. I think Brady and Belichick certainly had that in spades for years, although I think maybe there was a little bit of tension in their breakup, but they certainly had that. So I think it's hugely advantageous.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
The strategy piece is important, but the complete trust and confidence in your coach, I also think lets the players go out there and play knowing that good decisions are going to be made in the background.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And I don't mean to have Bill Cartwright catching shots out here, but ultimately, you know, Anthony Davis is a legit star as well. One of the five or 10 best big men in the NBA might be one of the 10 best players, far better defensively. And he's frankly, I think a pretty damn good fit on Dallas.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Yeah, I think within Canada, certainly amongst the people I speak to, my friends and family, I'd say 50% are annoyed by it and view it as offensive and a disrespectful situation, disrespectful set of comments relative to the longstanding great relationship between the two countries. I think 40% just sort of view it as Trump being bombastic, kind of find it funny, don't read too much into it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And, you know, don't think it's going to happen, aren't worried about it happening. I think it's just him puffing out his chest in a way that's sort of amusing. And then I think there's 10% of the folks I speak to who are genuinely irritated by it and find it, you know, truly horrifying because they think he might actually try and act on it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And then it's going to create, you know, significant repercussions. for the country. And I think the folks who are truly worried about it as compared to offended or amused is a distinct minority. I think close to 100% of Canadians, but that's probably a slight exaggeration, but most Canadians don't seem to be a fan of Justin Trudeau.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And so I think this has almost been a gift to Trudeau, where he has been pretty widely reviled at this point in the country, even by folks who are staunch liberal supporters, liberal voters. And so this is sort of giving him something to galvanize the country and to rally folks, which he desperately needed.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
But I think ultimately, the biggest thing I find interesting about it is President Trump, if nothing else, is somewhat unpredictable. I don't think that's a particularly noteworthy statement. And I think that's the honest dynamic and probably the part that for the folks who are worried about it, You know, it is alarming.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Do I think President Trump has any intent on actually pursuing a long term conflict with Canada or trying to annex it by force or anything like that? I mean, I would say clearly not. But, you know, obviously looking at things with the Panama Canal, Greenland, etc.,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
um you know you just you don't know for sure and i think that's probably what what keeps some people up and i think there are probably some folks who quietly think it would be fine for canada to be the 51st state uh both in canada and and here but i don't i don't envision that happening uh anytime soon no thank you very very much and i appreciate obviously i'm not a fan of him making those comments i mean it
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
So I think it's an interesting deal more than anything else, because he came completely out of left field. I think it's great for the Lakers to Not that they need help attracting superstars, but this will allow them to transition seamlessly from LeBron to their next generation and keep Luka around and build around him for the next decade.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I would love to hear you sing. I'm just hoping I don't have to hear the Canadian anthem booed tonight at the Blackhawks game. I'll settle for just silence. Sure.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Thanks for having me, Scott.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
There's a lot of speculation about how fit he was, whether they wanted to pay him, et cetera. I have no idea what's true or not. I will say seeing video and pictures of him
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
over the last week after the trade, he looks to be the exact same size he's been at all points in time while in Dallas, which is to say he's been one of the best players in the NBA his entire career at seemingly the exact same size as Ed Dow. So I don't put a lot of stock in that.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
It's different than, for example, when Zion Williamson was out with injuries and there were a lot of pictures that surfaced of him where he was visibly heavier and it looked like he hadn't taken care of himself taking care of himself while injured. Luka, you know, to me, it looks like he's fit and that Dallas may have been making excuses, but I do think Charles Barkley's general premise is right.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I subscribe to the notion that Dallas is a better title contender this year with Anthony Davis than they were with Luka. And I recognize that's an odd comment, you know, when they made it to the NBA finals last year. So they were right on the doorstep of a championship. So they were pretty damn close. But they now have an incredible front court with Davis, Lively, Gafford, and P.J. Washington.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
It's one of the deepest and most talented front courts in the league. And Kyrie Irving, who I'm certainly not a big fan of, but you can't deny the guy's talented and can play lead guard. So they had two guys who played a similar role with Luka and Kyrie. Now they have a much better complement. And so adding a pick down the road,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
and adding Max Christy, who I think will be a decent bench player, you know, whether that's fair value for Luca is in the eyes of the beholder, but I don't understand why, for example, Vegas had, you know, the Lakers title chances have gone down. Like the odds have gone down. In other words, they think.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Yeah, I think it's a legitimate concern. I think, you know, Luka is a guy who expects to have the ball in his hands in key moments. Clearly, LeBron feels the same, and both of them, frankly, have earned that right. LeBron more so, but they've both very much earned it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
So I think that's going to be an interesting dynamic, seeing how they share the ball, how they complement each other, whether it ends up helping with forced spacing because they can both shoot decently, although LeBron is not as elite a shooter as you might hope in that kind of combo situation. But I think the Lakers have some real foundational issues. They don't have much in the front court.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Without being overly critical of guys like Jackson Hayes, their front court is probably the worst in the NBA as it stands right now. And if not the worst, it's certainly bottom five. So I'm sure they'll make some additions to improve it. But they've now got a core that's got two absolute superstars who on offense both ideally would have the ball in their hands
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
and no front court to speak of, and defensively, there's not a lot there. I mean, Luke has never been a great defender, and LeBron used to be, but at this point, his effort sort of wanes on defense, and he's an imperfect defender at best. So I think the Lakers' build is pretty flawed this year, and I think it's interesting when people, including Vegas,
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
have been treating them as an enhanced title contender because I think they made a great move for the long-term future of the franchise. I don't know that it helped them today.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Yeah, fair question on both, and I think they're situated very differently. From Zach Levine's standpoint, I think it's more than anything else, it's a talent and ball possession situation. He's not a great defender. He's pretty mediocre on that end.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And he's a guy who's a streaky shooter, doesn't quite get to the hole as well as he used to, although he could still do it, and ultimately takes the ball out of the hands on the bulls of guys like Kobe White and Io DeSumo, who are talented players in their own right and who can really fill that gap and, frankly, are a little bit more diligent. on the defensive end, particularly Io.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And so I think there's a little bit of a Ewing theory, you know, the old belief that the Knicks were better when Ewing was out. There's a little bit of that dynamic going on with Levine where they have guys behind him who are capable of stepping in play and
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And it's a little bit more of a cohesive unit when he's not there, not because of any fault of his own, but just because he has so much ball gravity where the ball just keeps coming to him. And defensively, the effort is not great.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I don't think anyone's upset to see him go. I think the criticism that I've seen, which I think is reasonable, is that the Bulls got very little for him. They got three guys that I think it's generous to even describe all three as role players. I think only Jones is likely to play meaningful minutes for the Bulls.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
and they got their own first-round pick back, which is great, but it's already heavily protected, so they weren't likely to lose that pick in the next couple of seasons either way, and they got no other picks beyond it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
So I think the frustration is it's a very light return, and ultimately the Bulls have gone through, you know, the Lonzo Ball era because of injury was completely worthless, and they've basically given up DeRozan, Levine, and Alex Caruso for effectively a bag of beans. And so... That's unfortunate because the Bulls should be in a full rebuild, and they don't have a lot to show for it.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
I think Bruzella, the kid they drafted last year, looks promising, and they've got a couple other young pieces like Kobe White and Io, and Patrick Williams could be an okay role player. But for a team that's been bad for many years, or at least mediocre, they don't really have a lot of foundational pieces to excite you going forward, which I think puts them –
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Yeah, I mean, the first thing is the last thing you said, big surprise. It's mostly the most shocking trade I can remember offhand, I don't think there's been very many trades that I can recall where a legitimate superstar was traded without any warning, without a demand for a trade, without a contract dispute that had been percolating. I mean, it came completely out of left field.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
almost at the start of a rebuild, which is unfortunate when they should be probably in year six or seven.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Correct. I mean, I think he's a nice complementary piece. I think he could be a great bench big or potentially – a great effort and defense big on a contender with a lot of scoring around him, but he certainly wasn't, he didn't develop into what they were hoping for when they took him forth overall a few years ago.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
You know, the comparison I'm going to make, which is far more complimentary to Jimmy Butler than Dennis Rodman, but it's problematic because he's Jimmy Butler, is I think he's got the mentality of Michael Jordan, but he's not Michael Jordan. So he goes to all of these teams and he's done it at every team he's been to. He's elevated the level of play of his teammates. He's elevated the team.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
He is a singular talent. I mean, the guy is an excellent basketball player, but it's just clear he's not able to work within a team structure and turn off his own competitiveness and his own attitude to work with his teammates. And I think Michael Jordan had two main differences. I think he was wired in the same sort of competitive killer instinct way.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
But one, Michael Jordan was the best player ever. So I think there was a layer of tolerance there. for the folks around him in leadership, coaching staff, general manager, and teammates, that you had to take a little bit of grief because you were playing with the best ever, and he could get away with punching a Steve Kerr, allegedly, in practice or things like that because he was Michael Jordan.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
Jimmy Butler had the grace on his teammates, coaches, management alike, and I don't think he has that same level of grace. And then the second part of it is, ultimately, I think Jordan recognized that he was the elephant, he was the guy, but that his teammates were really, really important. And I think there is an element where Jimmy Butler views Jimmy Butler as being most important.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And the notion that he's offended at comments Pat Riley made last summer about his contractor, that he's now effectively rejecting trades and trying to force himself only to Phoenix. I just find stuff like that is somewhat off-putting when he's getting paid, you know, the better part of $60 million a year to play basketball.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
The heat of putting together what could be a contending team, if Jimmy was playing like he frankly has the ability to play, then he demands a trade and they try and ship him out, and now he's going to try and control where he's going and be difficult on that front as well.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And Luca is, you know, I think pretty clearly one of the five most marketable players in the league. So seeing a guy like that get traded, out of a market like Dallas is somewhat shocking, because that's usually a guy, a team like Dallas or Milwaukee with Yadis, you know, the guy you would build around and use to sell tickets.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
A hundred percent. I mean, that's, Jimmy Butler has always viewed it as my way or the highway. That's been how he's been from day one in the league. He is definitely a very talented player. And I think he's a guy you could build and win around, but he is difficult in the way that he expects everything to be done his way.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And sometimes that can be good where you're picking up your teammates and getting them all to play at the same level of excellence that you bring to the table. And I think that could sometimes be an asset. But I think in his case, there's also some negative where he does wear his welcome more quickly than the average NBA player.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
And it seems like he's certainly a little bit difficult to work with as well.
Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Prima Donnas in Business & Sports with David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP 2-7-25
um so i i have to pick the e i have to pick the chiefs sorry not the eagles um i i don't see a different way around it i i'm not betting against patrick mahomes period if he loses uh he loses but i'm not betting against him and it's one of those things as you know i was at the bill's chiefs game and was quietly and not so quietly hoping the bill's would get it done.