Elizabeth Day

100%.

That is such a good way of putting it.

Because obviously, I spend a lot of time thinking about failure and that means that I've spent a lot of time thinking about its shadow twin, success, and how I think of success has radically changed.

I saw something on Instagram yesterday saying that the true mark of success is a calm nervous system.

And I thought that was so good because that comes from knowledge.

Like,

The ability to retain your inner calm even when there is outer noise, the understanding that you don't have to take on everyone else's opinions, that everyone else isn't right and you're somehow wrong, that is success.

That is a measure of authenticity that only age and doing a podcast about failure really has brought me.

Because now, to go back right to what we were talking about at the beginning,

I feel so accepted by a community of people where I am able to show up as myself, as my deeply flawed self.

And that's been a revelation to me and something I'm forever grateful for.

Jamie, you know, that was one of your failures when you came on as fail.

I looked them up recently.

Your third failure was I'm 30 and I've still not had a successful long-term romantic relationship.

Was that it?

Yeah.

And I felt really moved and proud of you that now here we are five years later.

I totally agree.

I really think it's a good thing.

And I think as well, as I've mentioned, I'm 45.