Fareed Zakaria

But I actually sat on a jury recently, Farine, and I was really moved and impressed with how 12 people who didn't know each other and probably wouldn't spend any time together outside of the jury room came together with a common cause, and they weren't specialists.

They weren't chosen for their expertise in any area that the jury was engaging in.

They were just chosen because they happened to live in a place where they were required to serve jury duty.

And the idea being that rather than electing people

who managed to win an election because of their personality or money or background.

You're choosing actual representatives.

I know that sounds crazy, probably even to a political scientist like you, but I'm curious to know what you think of it.

Broken people.

The ones you don't want exercising power.

Same for co-op boards, by the way, in New York City.

Exactly, exactly.

Now, let's assume that that radical change will never happen.

Are there pieces of that idea that you see as possible amendments to the way that we run our elections now?

Economists now have enough data to measure a lot of the downstream effects of Brexit for Britain.

And they're not very good, as you could imagine.

But rather than being just political conversation, they're actually empirical arguments.

And those same economists say that when you look at the Trump presidency and what it's doing to our standing in the global economy, that it's going to take a while.

It's going to take five or 10 years before the effects can at least be fully measured the way that the Brexit effects have been measured.

When that time comes, what do you think those effects look like?

There was that one short spike during COVID spending that was like World War II spending, but briefly.