Fiona Harvey

So, you know, just get out there, say it, and then we can all deal with it.

You know, then we can have a national conversation about it, about what we need to do.

The government is preparing to spend more on defense than has been spent for many, many years in this country.

But it's actually getting that money partly by cutting the overseas aid budget.

And this report shows what...

How flawed that thinking is, really, because you are facing these threats overseas.

It would actually be a good use of the defence budget to help to restore and protect ecosystems overseas.

It's not charity.

It's investment in our own security.

So this connection is not being made between our national safety and where we're spending our money.

Yeah, very much so.

That is a very, very valid argument.

And in fact, that argument is being made across the world.

We're seeing in Spain, for instance, they are looking at spending some of their kind of, you know, the NATO spending on infrastructure, on resilience.

Right.

Similarly in Germany.

There are other countries looking at this too.

And the UK should certainly look at that because, you know, even under the sort of NATO terms, the narrow terms of NATO and, you know, how much you've got to spend of your national GDP, there's a certain amount, I think it's about 1.5%, that you can spend on sort of non-military stuff that is for resilience.

Yeah.

Well, you can spend that on making yourself more resilient to the climate crisis.