Fiona Hill

Yeah.

A lot of those people didn't vote for him and his personality and often could, because I know a lot of people who voted for him, first time and second time.

And they could disassociate

you know, kind of the, all of the kind of features of Donald Trump that drives other people nuts from, you know, what they thought that an actual fact he could achieve in terms of, and it wasn't just this kind of sense about, well, I couldn't possibly vote for Democrats.

Sometimes it's just like, well, look, he shakes things up and we need things to shake, to be shaken up.

And, um,

Yeah, some of them did as well, but I'm just saying that not all of them did either.

That's the thing.

Yeah, I can't say how much.

I'm just saying anecdotally, I know people have voted for him because he's him from the charisma.

And I know that he voted because he's shaking things up and, you know, he's keeping people on their toes and, you know, kind of we need that, you know, idea.

Yeah, I know it is.

I mean, that's what people do.

Look, I think part of that is, I mean, look, first of all, I want to say I completely agree with you about understanding where people are coming from.

And I think it's very important for people to listen to other people and their views.

I try to do that all the time, try to learn from that.

You know, I mean, everybody's got a perspective and a context.

We all live in a certain context.

We're all living in history.

Our own personal histories matter a lot.