Francis Foster

Wesley Clark, that's right.

I thought the other thing that Coleman did very well as well is I think the one thing Dave probably, in my opinion, underappreciates is the role of Islamism.

I think he often conflates Muslims with Islamists and there's a big fucking difference.

I have a lot of friends in the Middle East and places like the UAE, Saudi Arabia.

They all hate Hamas.

They all hate Islamists because they're a direct threat to them.

And I think Coleman really brought that out in the conversation as well, which is a lot of the motivation for these Islamist movements is an extreme version of Islam that is fundamentally about creating a caliphate and destroying the infidel.

And I think that sometimes gets lost as well.

I thought that was a really great discussion in which that was kind of brought to the surface as well.

And there's also a darker side to it, which is like, there's also the presence of potential violence in person as well.

Like, we all kind of don't want to go across certain lines because there's fucking consequences, potentially.

Now, in the three of us, it's only going one way, but you know what I mean?

Yeah, I know what you mean.

Among men, that's an ever-present thing, especially, right?

I think Mike Tyson made this point.

He said the internet made people very comfortable with talking shit about people.

Why would you go up to a UFC champion?

Is it like guys that think they're really hard that are trying to test themselves?

It's an antidote to bitterness and resentful, which I have to say I think is inevitable if you don't do that.

Right.