Giannis Pappas

And then sit down.

I don't know.

Because like you said, yeah, obviously NATO, you know.

was interested in ukraine nato's was interested in the former eastern bloc as well but the eastern bloc is very interested in joining nato finland's interested in joining nato not because nato's manipulating them like a lot of these theories just forget that these countries have agency and oh for sure but that's not the theory about the red line no no i'm just saying ukraine i'm just saying

That's very specific.

Ukraine wants to be part of NATO.

They want to be a democracy.

The majority of them do.

That's why they're fighting.

I mean, they're fighting.

We're not forcing them to fight.

I mean, they are fighting and dying.

They don't want to be part of Putin's world.

They don't want to be part of Russia's influence, and Putin doesn't like that.

And, you know, all those other former Soviet republics, too, that are now...

you know, part of NATO or aligned with NATO.

They're aligned with NATO as a precautionary measure to against Soviet expansion or former Soviet expansion or the threat of it.

Doesn't it suck that you even have to think about this?

It does suck, but we see it from here.

But when you go and you talk to people in Finland and places that the Soviet Union did invade and didn't conquer and did force into their republic, you know, the USSR,