Howie

I mean, you get a cold call from Canberra.

That's all you get saying, hey, how's the program going?

Yeah, it's going well.

Well, you know what?

You're no longer on it.

I mean, it just makes me so furious.

You know what?

It's...

It's letting people down so badly.

And this sort of thing changes perception of government at a time when they don't need it because at the moment they're up shit creek.

So, Carl, on that perception and the connection between the community and the government, as Victorians, you almost throw up your hands when you read about corruption and overspending coming off the back of COVID.

You're not talking about Victoria.

I mean, it's going all right down there.

And crime.

But it comes to the point where all these things, you throw up your hands and think, well, I can't do anything about this.

What can I do about it?

But a man with your platform...

You deal with the government day in, day out with your job on the TV and now with your podcast.

So how much pushing does it take from the community to affect change?

So I would say this, that if we get engagement with, I mean, the Labor Party is better than any other party at responding to an upheaval on social media that stacks up.