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Jake Sullivan

👤 Person
311 total appearances

Appearances Over Time

Podcast Appearances

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

A mere month before we took office in 2021, Europe signed a comprehensive investment agreement, a major trade agreement with China, right at the end of the Trump administration. This, to me, was a profound failure of the Trump administration to pull Europe along with us in a common view on this subject.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

A mere month before we took office in 2021, Europe signed a comprehensive investment agreement, a major trade agreement with China, right at the end of the Trump administration. This, to me, was a profound failure of the Trump administration to pull Europe along with us in a common view on this subject.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And what we did when we came in was say, we're going to put allies at the center of our strategy because a united front... vis-a-vis China is much more effective for the United States. That trade agreement, it's now on the shelf. And Europe has actually joined us in taking economic countermeasures against some of China's non-market economic practices.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And what we did when we came in was say, we're going to put allies at the center of our strategy because a united front... vis-a-vis China is much more effective for the United States. That trade agreement, it's now on the shelf. And Europe has actually joined us in taking economic countermeasures against some of China's non-market economic practices.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And in the Asia Pacific, if you look at what we've done with AUKUS, which is the US, Australia, and the United Kingdom putting together a nuclear submarine initiative, or what we've done with Japan and Korea in a trilateral arrangement. We have brought our alliances to a new level in terms of our ability to both burden share and deter China in the Indo-Pacific region.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And in the Asia Pacific, if you look at what we've done with AUKUS, which is the US, Australia, and the United Kingdom putting together a nuclear submarine initiative, or what we've done with Japan and Korea in a trilateral arrangement. We have brought our alliances to a new level in terms of our ability to both burden share and deter China in the Indo-Pacific region.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And then there are other areas where I think President Trump talked the right game but didn't deliver. The fundamental investments in America's industrial and innovation base that President Biden has done over the last four years were things that President Trump suggested he would do but never did, whether it's chips or clean energy or infrastructure.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And then there are other areas where I think President Trump talked the right game but didn't deliver. The fundamental investments in America's industrial and innovation base that President Biden has done over the last four years were things that President Trump suggested he would do but never did, whether it's chips or clean energy or infrastructure.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And those have put the United States in such a profound position of confidence and capacity in the competition with China, all the while also engaging in intense diplomacy so that the bottom doesn't drop out and we veer into conflict with China. We've managed the relationship stably. while also competing, in my view, quite effectively.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And those have put the United States in such a profound position of confidence and capacity in the competition with China, all the while also engaging in intense diplomacy so that the bottom doesn't drop out and we veer into conflict with China. We've managed the relationship stably. while also competing, in my view, quite effectively.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

Ezra, when we walked in the door, the conventional wisdom was two things. First, that China would surpass the United States economically within the next several years. And second, that China, not the United States, was going to lead the world in artificial intelligence. Because of what President Biden has done, nobody's talking about China surpassing the United States anytime soon and perhaps ever.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

Ezra, when we walked in the door, the conventional wisdom was two things. First, that China would surpass the United States economically within the next several years. And second, that China, not the United States, was going to lead the world in artificial intelligence. Because of what President Biden has done, nobody's talking about China surpassing the United States anytime soon and perhaps ever.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And second, the United States is the leading power when it comes to artificial intelligence, not China. And we intend to keep it that way. So I'm worried about that bottom dropping out.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

And second, the United States is the leading power when it comes to artificial intelligence, not China. And we intend to keep it that way. So I'm worried about that bottom dropping out.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

So what changed? I would say the main thing that's changed is China's changed. China's engaged in the largest peacetime military buildup in human history. Why? Why? It doesn't face any particular acute threat.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

So what changed? I would say the main thing that's changed is China's changed. China's engaged in the largest peacetime military buildup in human history. Why? Why? It doesn't face any particular acute threat.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

It's done so in no small part because it has signaled publicly that at some point it wants to ensure that Taiwan is part of China and has put explicitly on the table that military force is an option to make that happen. So that's just a reality that we confronted before we walked in the door, and we had to recognize that.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

It's done so in no small part because it has signaled publicly that at some point it wants to ensure that Taiwan is part of China and has put explicitly on the table that military force is an option to make that happen. So that's just a reality that we confronted before we walked in the door, and we had to recognize that.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

American policy towards China has been consistent over the course of decades. It is to maintain peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait and to deter the conflict you just described because that conflict would be absolutely catastrophic, economically catastrophic, catastrophic in terms of the loss of lives. And we should ensure it never happens.

The Ezra Klein Show
Biden Promised to ‘Turn the Page’ on Trump. What Went Wrong?

American policy towards China has been consistent over the course of decades. It is to maintain peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait and to deter the conflict you just described because that conflict would be absolutely catastrophic, economically catastrophic, catastrophic in terms of the loss of lives. And we should ensure it never happens.