Jenny Holland

And if the SSPX...

Because there's no way that Ratzinger would ever have liberalized the old mass if the SSPX hadn't existed.

If the SSPX isn't allowed to secure its Episcopal, if it's not able to ensure its Episcopal future and the ability to ordain its own priest, then it will die out.

And that was exactly the long game that John Paul II and Ratzinger were trying to bring about, right?

Right.

We spoke about this, I repeat, we spoke about this two weeks ago, about the SSPXs needed to get on with the job of Episcopal consecration to provide for the next generation.

I'm not sure this would have happened under Pagliani's predecessor, Bishop Fellet.

And I'm delighted to see that the SSPX is rediscovering its spine here because it is more important for any Catholic to remain obedient to tradition than it is to modernist hierarchs.

I wrote down what you said because it was so perfect, right?

I just want to check your quote before going on to quote you at future moments.

You said, if the SSPX did what the Vatican says, that would be the end of the traditional movement, right?

Frank Walker, that is the synthesis of what you said, yeah?

Because that's perfect.

That's true.

I made a note of that.

Great.

Well, we'll keep our beady cynical eyes fixed on this.

And I have to say, oh, right.

You mentioned Bishop Elegante, who's often indicated as being a traditional-minded bishop.

There was one bishop who came out and supported the SSPX, because he's so right again and again and again, and that was Archbishop Viganò, who is very much...