John R. Miles

So I'm bringing her up because I think it shows what you're talking about, that optimism doesn't have to equate with positivity.

Actually, if you look at my sister, Viktor Frankl or others,

they experienced optimism even during times of hardships.

And does your research show that this is true?

Before we continue, a quick note.

If today's conversation is making you rethink what optimism really means, I want to invite you to go deeper.

Throughout this Purpose by Design series, we've been exploring how we design meaning, belonging, resilience, and possibility into everyday life.

And that's exactly what I'm exploring each week on my substack, theignitedlife.net, through reflection tools, frameworks,

and workbooks designed to help you not just understand these ideas, but live them.

If you want to go deeper into building a more intentional, resilient, and ignited life, visit theignitedlife.net.

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Now, back to my conversation with Deepika Chopra.

One of the things you write in the book is that optimism enhances our physical health in many ways.

And a study you cite found that individuals who scored high in optimism lived on average 11 to 15 percent longer, and those who scored lower were significantly more likely

than pessimists to live to 80 or older.

So it has some really strong health benefits.

But one of the things I've covered a lot on the podcast is toxic positivity, which I think can do the exact opposite.

And I wanted to talk about sometimes the harms that toxic positivity can cause.