Jonathan Birch

Hi, Sean. Thanks for inviting me.

Hi, Sean. Thanks for inviting me.

Yeah, I suppose part of what I want to do with this book, The Edge of Sentience, is get people using that term sentience perhaps a bit more. I think Stephen Harnad's been doing much the same thing with his journal Animal Sentience. And I think it is a term that is on the way up. Good. That doesn't mean consciousness is on the way down, but I think it's plateauing and sentience is on the way up.

Yeah, I suppose part of what I want to do with this book, The Edge of Sentience, is get people using that term sentience perhaps a bit more. I think Stephen Harnad's been doing much the same thing with his journal Animal Sentience. And I think it is a term that is on the way up. Good. That doesn't mean consciousness is on the way down, but I think it's plateauing and sentience is on the way up.

And it's a term that, at least as I use it, it's an attempt to capture...

And it's a term that, at least as I use it, it's an attempt to capture...

the most basic elemental evolutionarily ancient base layer of consciousness as it were, which is in part, just what philosophers like to call phenomenal consciousness, subjective experience, there being something it feels like to be you, whether or not you have any kind of overlay of conscious reflection on what it is you're experiencing. And then also there's a,

the most basic elemental evolutionarily ancient base layer of consciousness as it were, which is in part, just what philosophers like to call phenomenal consciousness, subjective experience, there being something it feels like to be you, whether or not you have any kind of overlay of conscious reflection on what it is you're experiencing. And then also there's a,

a slight extra component as well, which is that I'm focusing specifically on experiences that feel good or feel bad, like pain or pleasure, valence experiences, as it were, they have a positive or negative valence and, And I'm using that term sentience to capture that capacity for valence to experience like pain and pleasure.

a slight extra component as well, which is that I'm focusing specifically on experiences that feel good or feel bad, like pain or pleasure, valence experiences, as it were, they have a positive or negative valence and, And I'm using that term sentience to capture that capacity for valence to experience like pain and pleasure.

And I think it's a really important concept because it, to me at least, captures what is really ethically significant. If a system is sentient in that sense, if it's capable of valence to experience, then its interests matter morally and we need to do something about that.

And I think it's a really important concept because it, to me at least, captures what is really ethically significant. If a system is sentient in that sense, if it's capable of valence to experience, then its interests matter morally and we need to do something about that.

Well, I wouldn't say that to have a conscious experience, you need to know about it. But the problem is that the term consciousness gets used in quite ambiguous ways. And it can refer to the human form of consciousness, which is a very complex form, I think. And it does have Layers. So Herbert Feigl in the 50s talked about sentience, sapience, and selfhood.

Well, I wouldn't say that to have a conscious experience, you need to know about it. But the problem is that the term consciousness gets used in quite ambiguous ways. And it can refer to the human form of consciousness, which is a very complex form, I think. And it does have Layers. So Herbert Feigl in the 50s talked about sentience, sapience, and selfhood.

Tolving in a separate body of work had these terms, anoetic, noetic, autonoetic. They're both ways of trying to capture the idea that there's layers. There's the raw, basic, subjective experience, like the feelings of pain, pleasure, sight, sound, odor. Then there's also the knowledge and the concepts when we think and reflect about what's going on.

Tolving in a separate body of work had these terms, anoetic, noetic, autonoetic. They're both ways of trying to capture the idea that there's layers. There's the raw, basic, subjective experience, like the feelings of pain, pleasure, sight, sound, odor. Then there's also the knowledge and the concepts when we think and reflect about what's going on.

And then also to some extent, there's a sense of self as well. And this idea, we recognize ourselves to be persisting subjects of experience with lives that extend into the past and extend into the future. And these overlays,

And then also to some extent, there's a sense of self as well. And this idea, we recognize ourselves to be persisting subjects of experience with lives that extend into the past and extend into the future. And these overlays,

They involve levels of cognitive sophistication that you might not need to have that base level of just sentience, of just feeling ouch, feeling pain, feeling happiness, joy. Right.

They involve levels of cognitive sophistication that you might not need to have that base level of just sentience, of just feeling ouch, feeling pain, feeling happiness, joy. Right.