Jonathan Herzog

up swinging from Obama to Trump.

And that was the theory of the case, that automation and the fourth industrial revolution was what was driving this sense of malaise and frustration.

Now, if you look at the 2016 campaign, what were the two dominant messages?

Make America great again.

And essentially, America is already great.

The thing is, the deaths of despair, the fact that suicides and drug overdoses from opiates had overtaken vehicle deaths as leading causes of death, and the Ponzi scheme level of inequality, these are all true.

And so...

centering a campaign a national presidential campaign around america's already great and if you look at the data where the clinton campaign won were disproportionately in cities that were winning from the sort of uh globalization neoliberal consensus um and so in terms of well who can the human mind then um blame or scapegoat if it's not the chinese if it's not the mexicans if it's not the jews

In our case, it was the robots.

And I love this because A, I think it's empirically accurate.

B, it feeds into our mind's need to find an easy, simple answer for the confusion and again, the pain and suffering that runs deep and is real.

But that target is not human.

It is systemic, it's structural, and it is

in the Amazon warehouses, right?

It's certainly a lot more potent.

It's a lot more potent when you can rile up your base and call together all this energy and vitriol towards a person or a group of people, particularly a group that has been historically the brunt of that narrative.

I hear you.

I think to me, what was so empowering, and yes, we did not win the White House, right?

We did not win the presidency this time.

But what I will say is,