Jonathan Kieperman (Lomez)

There's this great moment in Who Framed Roger Rabbit where Roger is handcuffed to the detective and And this is causing them all sorts of problems. And the detective is trying to saw the handcuffs off. And Roger at one point just slips out of the handcuffs in this sight gag. You know, it's funny. And the detective very angrily says to him, you're telling me you could do that at any time?

There's this great moment in Who Framed Roger Rabbit where Roger is handcuffed to the detective and And this is causing them all sorts of problems. And the detective is trying to saw the handcuffs off. And Roger at one point just slips out of the handcuffs in this sight gag. You know, it's funny. And the detective very angrily says to him, you're telling me you could do that at any time?

And Roger Rabbit says to him, no, only when it's funny. And the upshot of this anecdote is that if it's funny, okay, and funny here now is a stand-in for has artistic value independent of the thing happening, then it's worth preserving and worth participating in. So this Tintin book or Tantan, I don't know. Tantan is the like snobby French way of saying it.

And Roger Rabbit says to him, no, only when it's funny. And the upshot of this anecdote is that if it's funny, okay, and funny here now is a stand-in for has artistic value independent of the thing happening, then it's worth preserving and worth participating in. So this Tintin book or Tantan, I don't know. Tantan is the like snobby French way of saying it.

Real Americans. You know, I'm a vulgar populist, you know, Trump supporters.

Real Americans. You know, I'm a vulgar populist, you know, Trump supporters.

Yeah. So the operating question for me as a publisher is, is it funny? And again, does it have value? Does it have artistic merit? Then there's also the archival thing. You know, the archival function is very important for a publisher. These are important texts. They tell us something not just about who we were, but in turn about who we are.

Yeah. So the operating question for me as a publisher is, is it funny? And again, does it have value? Does it have artistic merit? Then there's also the archival thing. You know, the archival function is very important for a publisher. These are important texts. They tell us something not just about who we were, but in turn about who we are.

And simply forgetting that these things existed does nobody any good at all. I don't think we need to protect people from that kind of offense. The other point, which is, aren't these sort of views bad, though? And so we should disarm on these questions, if I understand what you're putting to me. And I would say maybe kind of.

And simply forgetting that these things existed does nobody any good at all. I don't think we need to protect people from that kind of offense. The other point, which is, aren't these sort of views bad, though? And so we should disarm on these questions, if I understand what you're putting to me. And I would say maybe kind of.

It depends because these views do have consequences that we need to properly address. And the only way to address them is by being honest about causes. So if we're talking about, for example, crime rates and we see like uneven incarceration rates and our answer is, well, there's over-policing. And then our solution to that is we get rid of police.

It depends because these views do have consequences that we need to properly address. And the only way to address them is by being honest about causes. So if we're talking about, for example, crime rates and we see like uneven incarceration rates and our answer is, well, there's over-policing. And then our solution to that is we get rid of police.

Well, that has a that creates an increase in crime. And no, as long as disarming on these questions and not being honest about these questions allows for these kinds of social pathologies to sort of rule over how we function in life, I think is bad. And we need to be honest about them. Right. And it's not yet. But what?

Well, that has a that creates an increase in crime. And no, as long as disarming on these questions and not being honest about these questions allows for these kinds of social pathologies to sort of rule over how we function in life, I think is bad. And we need to be honest about them. Right. And it's not yet. But what?

No, not necessarily. I think there are publishers who are already filling that niche, so it's not my responsibility to do that. But also, if you're the kind of person who's interested in that content, it's been there and you can go find it. And I'm glad you can. I think actually these things are important for us to be able to discuss and...

No, not necessarily. I think there are publishers who are already filling that niche, so it's not my responsibility to do that. But also, if you're the kind of person who's interested in that content, it's been there and you can go find it. And I'm glad you can. I think actually these things are important for us to be able to discuss and...

I would say this to your concern about these racial taboos in particular, actually don't treat them any different than any other kind of political or social taboo. There's some added maybe vitriol or sharpness to some of these memes we're seeing now. But that's that's mostly because this is a topic of conversation, a category of conversation that has been entirely verboten. For a while now.

I would say this to your concern about these racial taboos in particular, actually don't treat them any different than any other kind of political or social taboo. There's some added maybe vitriol or sharpness to some of these memes we're seeing now. But that's that's mostly because this is a topic of conversation, a category of conversation that has been entirely verboten. For a while now.

OK, let's let's call it at least several decades. And the problem with this particular topic, in my view, is it starts with the supposition that it's firstly a moral question and any decent person, morally decent person already agrees with these basic sort of anti-racist premises. Right. So to even raise the questions, it's a mark against your character.

OK, let's let's call it at least several decades. And the problem with this particular topic, in my view, is it starts with the supposition that it's firstly a moral question and any decent person, morally decent person already agrees with these basic sort of anti-racist premises. Right. So to even raise the questions, it's a mark against your character.