Kathryn VanArendonk

And so those are the things where I look at both of those shows and I see the shared interests, shared qualities.

Yeah.

Yeah, they both feel a little bit like shibboleths.

Like you walk up to somebody else and they're like, what TV do you like?

And you're like, oh, you know.

And then you say the title of either of them.

And if they recognize them or have watched any of it, you're like, okay, I understand who you are.

A hundred percent.

But they – which I think is –

It's got to be somewhat frustrating because it is the kind of thing that makes it hard to argue for these shows' relevance, for these people to then go on to make other shows, to use this to turn around and say, I now would like to make this other cool new project.

They feel like they live in these secret little spaces.

But I think there is something—this was sort of the promise of streaming, right?

The promise of cable, that you could have these perfectly good shows—

that live in these interesting niches and don't have to be for everyone and don't have to speak to all of what's happening in culture at any moment.

Yeah, and Lord knows that was the case for Apple TV at the beginning too.

Although at least Apple has like severance.

It has like a couple of – Yeah.

Among TV fans, you say the name of those shows and you're not going to get the, I've literally never heard of that before.

Outlander seems ripe for it.

Yeah, yeah.