Kevin Young

And at first it kind of almost is set there, and then you jar us with the internet and with now and this kind of contrast.

How do you hear the poem now, hearing it again?

These sounds strike me, all these why sounds, crazy, comparatively, completely, liberally, crummy.

And you managed to sort of half rhyme pus and polyps.

I never thought I would see that or admire it so much.

Life goes.

But how do you see these kind of this double vision that's happening in the poem?

And how soon was bro cream in the poem?

Was that always there?

And were you curating these kind of images of the past?

Or there's many things you could mention.

And you go with, you know, bro cream and, you know, un-American committee and this kind of pun with liberally and playing with liberalism.

Tell me about it.

So I think there's – again, that's another kind of double vision because in some way what you're describing is, as you put it, a kind of cliché of the 50s.

And then you're saying even the cliché doesn't – you know, so it doesn't exactly exist, but it also doesn't include you.

It's a little like growing up with happy days or, you know, like I love these ideas of the 70s version of the 50s is different than the 80s version is different than, you know, our version.

And I think in a way –

having O'Hara at the end kind of makes us rethink and go back where O'Hara, you know, at the time wasn't considered one of the central poets.

And now if you pull poets under a certain age, they would say absolutely Frank O'Hara is one of the key poets.

Even his friends didn't know how much of a poet he was just from his books because he was sending poems to people in letters that we now have and we didn't have at the time.