Lulu Garcia Navarro

Do you, Secretary Blinken, worry that perhaps you have been presiding over what the world will see as a genocide?

Do you, Secretary Blinken, worry that perhaps you have been presiding over what the world will see as a genocide?

Your tenure, as we've said, has been filled with many complicated conflicts. At the same time, there's been a lot of reporting on President Biden's declining abilities over the course of his term. You are one of the closest people to him. You have worked with him for decades. By some accounts, he considers you a surrogate son.

Your tenure, as we've said, has been filled with many complicated conflicts. At the same time, there's been a lot of reporting on President Biden's declining abilities over the course of his term. You are one of the closest people to him. You have worked with him for decades. By some accounts, he considers you a surrogate son.

This is a delicate question to ask, but I do feel that many Americans want to understand that. If you saw changes from the man that you knew so well.

This is a delicate question to ask, but I do feel that many Americans want to understand that. If you saw changes from the man that you knew so well.

Last summer, my colleague Robert Draper reported that people in the diplomatic corps worried that the president's memory, for example, was showing signs of slipping while he was meeting with foreign leaders.

Last summer, my colleague Robert Draper reported that people in the diplomatic corps worried that the president's memory, for example, was showing signs of slipping while he was meeting with foreign leaders.

On a personal note, your own story is very much defined by this fight against autocracy. Your stepfather was a Holocaust survivor who was saved from the death camps by American soldiers. It's an incredible story. You've said that you learned lessons from him about what our country is and what it represents and what it means when the United States is engaged in leading the

On a personal note, your own story is very much defined by this fight against autocracy. Your stepfather was a Holocaust survivor who was saved from the death camps by American soldiers. It's an incredible story. You've said that you learned lessons from him about what our country is and what it represents and what it means when the United States is engaged in leading the

And I'm wondering, as you look at the end of your tenure, as you've been leading over the last four years, and you're handing off, as we've discussed, many of these conflicts that are still unresolved, and you have come under a lot of criticism, do his lessons strike you differently now than they did before that you've been through the fire, so you will, of really being the person at the forefront of making these very, very difficult choices?

And I'm wondering, as you look at the end of your tenure, as you've been leading over the last four years, and you're handing off, as we've discussed, many of these conflicts that are still unresolved, and you have come under a lot of criticism, do his lessons strike you differently now than they did before that you've been through the fire, so you will, of really being the person at the forefront of making these very, very difficult choices?

Secretary, thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it.

Secretary, thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it.

That's outgoing Secretary of State Antony Blinken. This conversation was produced by Elisa Gutierrez. It was edited by Annabel Bacon, mixing by Sophia Landman. Original music by Dan Powell and Marion Lozano. Photography by Philip Montgomery. The rest of the team is Wyatt Orem, Seth Kelly, and Priya Matthew. Our executive producer is Alison Benedict.

That's outgoing Secretary of State Antony Blinken. This conversation was produced by Elisa Gutierrez. It was edited by Annabel Bacon, mixing by Sophia Landman. Original music by Dan Powell and Marion Lozano. Photography by Philip Montgomery. The rest of the team is Wyatt Orem, Seth Kelly, and Priya Matthew. Our executive producer is Alison Benedict.

Special thanks to Jessica Lustig, Edward Wong, Chris Buckley, Joel Hellman, Afim Shapiro, Rory Walsh, Renan Borelli, Jeffrey Miranda, Maddy Maciello, Nick Pittman, Jake Silverstein, Paula Schumann, and Sam Doldick. If you like what you're hearing, follow or subscribe to The Interview wherever you get your podcasts.

Special thanks to Jessica Lustig, Edward Wong, Chris Buckley, Joel Hellman, Afim Shapiro, Rory Walsh, Renan Borelli, Jeffrey Miranda, Maddy Maciello, Nick Pittman, Jake Silverstein, Paula Schumann, and Sam Doldick. If you like what you're hearing, follow or subscribe to The Interview wherever you get your podcasts.

To read or listen to any of our conversations, you can always go to nytimes.com slash The Interview. And you can email us anytime at theinterviewatnytimes.com. Next week, David talks with Ben Stiller about the upcoming season of Severance.

To read or listen to any of our conversations, you can always go to nytimes.com slash The Interview. And you can email us anytime at theinterviewatnytimes.com. Next week, David talks with Ben Stiller about the upcoming season of Severance.