Mariana van Zeller

And I asked her, have you ever actually spent time with anyone who's struggling to buy their medications?

As the head of this pharmaceutical lobby, have you spent time with any of these people?

She was like, no.

Like straight out, no.

It's like, how can you represent the pharmaceutical companies?

Know that one of the biggest problems we have in this country is that people cannot afford these medications and not have spent one single minute with a person who has a hard time affording these medications, right?

But it's that disconnect that you're talking about, right?

It's not actually understanding the problem or wanting to know the people that are being affected by these problems.

Yeah, and paying their CEOs millions of dollars.

I agree with you, and I know that it's a huge conflict of interest, and we've seen how bad that can be and how bad it can be.

But I also, I try to put myself, I've spent my whole,

whole entire career, you know, with ambition and trying to do good.

And then I end up at the FDA and I have a chance to do something good.

And then I, yeah, whatever happens, I lose my job or I,

I know, but I try to look at it through other eyes and see like, OK, we have to figure out what these people are going to do because what do you do after if you can't work for 10 years?

This is what they've lived all their lives working in, right?

Right.

But I don't think all of them.

I think a lot of people – and I've interviewed the head of the CDC.

It was a while back.