Max Chandler-Mather

First, you have this, well, it's only going to be at 15%.

He's never going to win.

Pauline Hanson's never going to win.

And then you get to sort of the 30%.

You're like, well, this is only happening because...

you know, this sort of insinuation that there's just a bad section of the population and they're voting in a bad way.

But the majority of people would never do that.

And at no point is there ever a sense where people slow down and think, well, people are experts in their own lives.

I believe that.

Why are a lot of people, good, honest people, deciding that they want such a break with the status quo?

And Labor at the moment have decided that they're still like a deer in their headlights, thinking that what this moment requires is this quote-unquote steady hand, when what's clear is that any political movement across the world at the moment, especially in Western democracies, succeeds when they've recognised the scale of the challenges in people's lives and offer a comparable break.

Politically, like policy-wise, it's not that hard, but it does require taking on a lot of vested interests and corporate interests.

And I think Jeremy Corbyn in 2017, off the back of nationalizing all their utilities and building a million public homes,

He was able to get this surge.

Andy Burnham in the UK is partly popular because he's seen as bringing the bus system in Manchester into public hands and wants to nationalise water utilities similar to the UK Greens and Zach Polanski.

Rather than this sort of tinkering, what they're proposing is big, qualitative structural change.

And rhetorically, I think that's really important.

The thing that it hasn't solved yet is that organisational question.

Yeah, I think so.

I think there's always going to be a debate about specifics, right?