Natalie Kitro-Eff

From The New York Times, I'm Natalie Kitro-Eff. This is The Daily. Last week, financial markets went into a panic over an obscure Chinese tech startup called DeepSeek. That company now threatens to upend the world of artificial intelligence and the race for who will dominate it.

From The New York Times, I'm Natalie Kitro-Eff. This is The Daily. Last week, financial markets went into a panic over an obscure Chinese tech startup called DeepSeek. That company now threatens to upend the world of artificial intelligence and the race for who will dominate it.

Today, my colleague Kevin Roos, a tech columnist and the co-host of the podcast Hard Fork, on how DeepSeek caught us all off guard. It's Monday, February 3rd. Hi, Kevin. Hello.

Today, my colleague Kevin Roos, a tech columnist and the co-host of the podcast Hard Fork, on how DeepSeek caught us all off guard. It's Monday, February 3rd. Hi, Kevin. Hello.

So let's jump in. Kevin, how did this giant AI tech freakout begin? Tell us that story.

So let's jump in. Kevin, how did this giant AI tech freakout begin? Tell us that story.

How cheap are we talking?

How cheap are we talking?

Okay, we're going to get to those questions of who this company is and how they did this. But I just first want to dig into the anatomy of the market panic. What are the real fears driving this?

Okay, we're going to get to those questions of who this company is and how they did this. But I just first want to dig into the anatomy of the market panic. What are the real fears driving this?

Yeah. And should I maybe be investing in balsa wood cars?

Yeah. And should I maybe be investing in balsa wood cars?

Kevin, it certainly seems that at least based on what DeepSeek is saying, it has managed to pull off a pretty impressive feat here. But I'm wondering, can we trust what the company says? Can we trust their claims about how they pulled this off?

Kevin, it certainly seems that at least based on what DeepSeek is saying, it has managed to pull off a pretty impressive feat here. But I'm wondering, can we trust what the company says? Can we trust their claims about how they pulled this off?

Okay, so let's talk about those engineering techniques. I mean, how actually did DeepSeq do this? Make a chatbot on a shoestring budget, potentially, with second-rate chips?

Okay, so let's talk about those engineering techniques. I mean, how actually did DeepSeq do this? Make a chatbot on a shoestring budget, potentially, with second-rate chips?

And it occurs to me, Kevin, that this company was operating under a lot of constraints. And it sounds like that may have forced the engineers to think about how to tackle this problem differently. As in, it seems possible that not having these critical ingredients actually bred innovation.

And it occurs to me, Kevin, that this company was operating under a lot of constraints. And it sounds like that may have forced the engineers to think about how to tackle this problem differently. As in, it seems possible that not having these critical ingredients actually bred innovation.

So, Kevin, how do the big American tech companies contend with that? I mean, what do they say to investors who are wondering about whether maybe these companies have been throwing money away when some of this work on these AI models could have been done much more cheaply?

So, Kevin, how do the big American tech companies contend with that? I mean, what do they say to investors who are wondering about whether maybe these companies have been throwing money away when some of this work on these AI models could have been done much more cheaply?