Nate Hagens

revving up ideas.

But here it's like you have to get control of that.

So my second question is, is this once and done like Ibogaine or do you have to do this for months or years in the dark to get to those lower levels?

Yeah, this is so great.

What does that mean?

You want to keep people out?

Some of the podcasts and some of the documentaries and some of the stuff that's coming out, it's not like... Oh, it's actually co-opting this in service of light, but it's a gimmicky thing that's darkness, but it defeats the goal of what you're trying to espouse.

There's so many ways to do this practice.

Well, and you're still you've mentioned several times we're doing the scientists.

My scientists are doing this.

So you're testing this now.

So how long are you – you offer dark retreats for people.

How long are those?

Well, yeah, I would be...

I would be pretty hesitant to have an overdose of Nate Hagans at the moment.

What's the longest you've ever done?

Yeah.

No lights at all?

Not checking your phone in the middle of it?

Nothing.