Nish Kumar

Is there a threat to him that he's bringing in some

Certainly in Robert Jenrick, relatively high profile figures from the British right.

Get an interview, Liam.

You could write a whole book about somebody defecting from Greens to reform.

Liam, what's behind this delay?

For context, for listeners who might not be fully aware of some of the details of this, the police initially blamed the fans.

They fed false stories of drunken hooliganism to the press.

There was an infamous Sun front page that alleged that Liverpool fans had, and this is a direct quote, urinated on the brave cops and...

pick the pockets of victims.

A 2012 independent panel found that 164 police statements had been altered.

This is direct interference by the state.

It's an institutional cover-up.

And I think, Liam, I think you're so correct to...

bracket this with the post office scandal and the infected blood scandal and discuss it as part of a pattern of institutional cover-ups within the British state.

Ian Byrne, who's the MP for Liverpool West and has been a longtime campaigner for the law said, it's imperative that any legislation leaving the commons is truly worthy of being called the Hillsborough law.

before it proceeds to the Lords.

Would you say that that is a sentiment being shared by the families at the moment, that it's not so much an anger that this thing is being delayed as it is a real burning desire from everybody who's been campaigning for it for so long to get it right?

You're an experienced journalist.

You've written about a huge number of stories over the years.

And, you know, especially on the political side of things, there's so much weekly churn.