Oren Cass

How did this happen? It's a great question. The way I understand it is not quite that it's a perversion. I think it's also important to say, at the end of the day, the folks doing a lot of this stuff on Wall Street, it's also in a lot of companies that are even operating companies, increasingly they try to suck money out for shareholders rather than build up companies. Right.

It's not like they're doing anything illegal. They're not even lying about it. It's not a scam. They are operating in the system as we have constructed it.

The core of the problem in my mind is that the entire premise of capitalism – you go all the way back to Adam Smith and all the way back to the invisible hand. The core of your critique is the entire system of capitalism? No, exactly the opposite. I think that the entire system of capitalism – well, this is a good point. A lot of people say, well, this is the problem. Capitalism is just broken and can't –

I feel exactly the opposite. I think that the basic premise of capitalism, the idea that you want to have a system where – people are always going to pursue their self-interest, right? So the question is can you have a system in which people pursuing their self-interest also serves the public interest? So that the things that generate the most profit for you also turn out to be good for other people.

Ja jos mennään aivan takaisin Adam Smithin Invisible Handiin, tämä on oikeastaan se, mitä hän mainitsi. Invisible Hand on tullut tällaiseen, se on huono metafori, koska se kuulostaa tällaiseen mahtavaan vahvaan. Se ei ole välttämättä, mitä sinä teet, jotenkaan mahtavaan se toimii hyvin kaikille. Niin kauan kuin et mene. Se ei ollut se idea, että hallitseet eivät pitäisi mene.

What these markets will create on their own through supply and demand and the other... Well, that was certainly not Smith's view. That is what it has become for a lot of modern economists. But if you go back, the paragraph where Smith uses the term invisible hand, he only uses it once.

It actually starts by noting that he's expecting that people will prefer investing domestically to investing in foreign countries, and that people will prefer to invest in the ways that produce the most things of greatest value. What he's saying is that if that's true, if somebody pursuing profit, the way they're going to do it is by investing a lot domestically in creating things of value,

Silloin on näin, että on näin, että on näin, että on näin, että on näin, että on näin.

Ja sitten se on vaikeaa. Se on oikeastaan. Ja tämä menee minulle siihen, että mitä ihmiset tekevät, mitä on mennyt väärin. Se näyttää minulle niin, että ihmiset ja heidän itsearvoa ovat aina menossa katsomaan järjestelmää ja sanomaan, että onko siellä vielä helpompaa tavalla tehdä enemmän rahaa. Ehkä se ei luo niin paljon hyvää asiaa muille ihmisille.

Se tapahtuu koko ajan historiassa. Kun mennään taustarevoluuttiin, taustarevoluutti toimii huonosti useimmille työntekijöille. Ihmiset ovat menneet vähemmän ja kuolevat myöhemmin. Ihmiset sanoisivat, että tarvitsisimme töitä.

Olemme varmaan tarpeeksi tekemään sääntöä, että kun rakennamme näitä suuret... Jos olet 8-vuotias, et pitäisi olla maksajassa. Ehkä myös se. Ehkä tämä toimii paremmin, jos yksi vaikutuksista, joita teemme, on, että jos haluat tehdä paljon rahaa rakentamalla isoja maksajia, sinun on myös tarvitse käyttää vanhempia työntekijöitä ja käsitellä heitä luonnollisesti.

That will work and then in fact people started doing that and you had what I would call the much more beneficial industrial revolution that led to huge productivity gains, ultimately the creation of the middle class. You had the same thing at the end of the 19th century with the giant trusts, Rockefeller and so forth and railroads and utilities. People were saying like, oh, I could make a lot of money if I just monopolize this thing. Yeah.

Well, that's a fair point. And that's when Teddy Roosevelt shows up and says like, well, okay, right? Teddy Roosevelt, Republican, but this system does not work. We actually are going to have to do trust busting. And so I think you sort of go through these cycles where then what happened in the second half of the 20th century –

You have the financialization, and I think globalization are sort of parallel. A lot of people said, wow, and obviously we pursued free trade, we deregulated financial markets. And people said, well, this is great. The easiest way to make a lot of money is to do this set of things that does not create good jobs, does not necessarily produce growth. So that's what people started doing. Look, the algorithm.

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