Pablo Torre

I think you need to have rigorous and well-funded research into the harms of gambling, in which we are now following, by the way, the parallels to the regulation of cigarettes.

I mean, look, the European system, Bob, which I think you're familiar with for cigarettes, is what?

What do they put on the boxes?

It's got the whole cancer or whatever.

They put the graphic images of this is what can happen to you if you develop an addiction to this product.

And I think some disclosure around that, to me, it's always about disclosure.

It's about here are the risks.

All of which is to say that I did find this conversation both fascinating and useful, especially on the question of what enormous legalized menus of prop bets on individual players, their unders especially, have done to incentivize illicit underperformance in games.

which did lead Bob and I to agree on one thing as far as NBA incentives are concerned, because we both think that the league now has a genuine problem in trying to distinguish between two different types of NBA teams, one legal and one illegal, that both underperform on purpose.

It is very funny, by the way, that the overlooked subplot of this indictment that you're referring to is that the government basically establishes as a matter of observable fact that the Blazers were tanking games.

And that's now on the record for all time, basically.

Right.

Look, as somebody who like exhaustively reported on the process and the Sixers, I mean, my solution to all of this has never been teams should be allowed to tank with impunity.

My solution has been you need to change the rules so that the incentives are not causing people to tank games.

The real like upshot of what you're saying is if you're going to have a position where

that says the integrity of our sport is paramount and fair play is paramount, then you need to also be consistent in terms of the ways in which you are enabling the forces that eat away at integrity and fair play.

Where I fully agree with you is the appropriate amount of pressure to put on the NBA to catch this stuff needs to go up, right?

So the question is, how do you incent

that.

But what would you do?