Peter Jones

We would call them now monks.

But at the time, it didn't have a label like this, really.

These were lost souls who were looking for a radical experiment in living.

And they moved to the desert about two days' walk outside of Alexandria.

And they'd build these little cells.

you know, far away from each other, close enough you could wave and see someone waving, but not see their facial expressions.

It's kind of lonely.

And Vagris was one of these.

Spent his day weaving baskets, watching the sun rise and set, and trying to, you know, it's mindfulness really, you know, thinking a lot, contemplating, meditating.

And Vagrius puts himself through a load of experiments.

He stands in freezing cold water.

He sort of flagellates himself.

But he also decides he's going to do a mind experiment.

He's going to write down every tempting, negative, difficult thought in this enormous thing, which he later publishes as a book, which we call Talking Back.

And in that book, some of these thoughts are really petty.

I miss the cup I used to hold in my hand.

I miss my life.

I miss my family's olive grove in Ibora on the Black Sea.

And he decided, when he got all of these thoughts written down, they all belonged in eight sort of categories.

Nice.