Pia Sinha

And I think that the taxpayers need to kind of start asking those searching questions. How much is this costing them for something that's not effective?

And I think that the taxpayers need to kind of start asking those searching questions. How much is this costing them for something that's not effective?

Correct.

Correct.

Do you know what it stands for, IPP? Imprisonment for Public Protection.

Do you know what it stands for, IPP? Imprisonment for Public Protection.

So sentence inflation, some of it is because of perception of showing overtly that you're tough on crime. So when I started in the prison service 25 years ago, an average life sentence tariff would be something like 12 years. So even if you got a life sentence, it'd be 12 years tariff and then you'd be eligible for parole. It's now... pushing 20 years.

So sentence inflation, some of it is because of perception of showing overtly that you're tough on crime. So when I started in the prison service 25 years ago, an average life sentence tariff would be something like 12 years. So even if you got a life sentence, it'd be 12 years tariff and then you'd be eligible for parole. It's now... pushing 20 years.

And in that 20 years, as you say, David, is that unless you're doing something meaningful, purposeful, that's helping you feel hope and working towards all of those issues that might've got you into prison in the first place, the prison sentence itself becomes a source of deteriorating your wellbeing and your mental health.

And in that 20 years, as you say, David, is that unless you're doing something meaningful, purposeful, that's helping you feel hope and working towards all of those issues that might've got you into prison in the first place, the prison sentence itself becomes a source of deteriorating your wellbeing and your mental health.

So with the IPP sentence, it's described as one of the biggest stains on the justice system. And people who are part of there have developed really poor mental health as a result of that. It's tantamount to torture.

So with the IPP sentence, it's described as one of the biggest stains on the justice system. And people who are part of there have developed really poor mental health as a result of that. It's tantamount to torture.

it's good to look at what were the factors that led up to you going to prison if you can change that then you probably won't be going to prison anymore you know yeah 100% and so the presumption against short sentences is a is a really effective way of of reshaping the criminal justice system because also if you pair that up if you say well we won't send you to prison and

it's good to look at what were the factors that led up to you going to prison if you can change that then you probably won't be going to prison anymore you know yeah 100% and so the presumption against short sentences is a is a really effective way of of reshaping the criminal justice system because also if you pair that up if you say well we won't send you to prison and

But we'll give you a non-custodial sentence. We'll make it a suspended sentence. So there is a bit of deterrence there. We'll put in a treatment order. So if it's about drugs, we'll get you some drug intervention, treatment, et cetera, et cetera. Evidence shows that they're much more effective in reducing reoffending.

But we'll give you a non-custodial sentence. We'll make it a suspended sentence. So there is a bit of deterrence there. We'll put in a treatment order. So if it's about drugs, we'll get you some drug intervention, treatment, et cetera, et cetera. Evidence shows that they're much more effective in reducing reoffending.

slip up again and go away you know i feel like there should be more a lot more intervention yeah 100 but also there needs to be a bit more tolerance as well these some some individuals it takes more than one go for it to be successful so you know you you might get all of those things and you mess up but you know that happens in life you know you don't just kind of go that's it that's it you only get one chance at it so there has to be some tolerance of of risk as well

slip up again and go away you know i feel like there should be more a lot more intervention yeah 100 but also there needs to be a bit more tolerance as well these some some individuals it takes more than one go for it to be successful so you know you you might get all of those things and you mess up but you know that happens in life you know you don't just kind of go that's it that's it you only get one chance at it so there has to be some tolerance of of risk as well

And well, one of the biggest things that reduces a factor in desistance is just simply maturity. So as you get older, you do that a lot more. You think about consequences a lot more.

And well, one of the biggest things that reduces a factor in desistance is just simply maturity. So as you get older, you do that a lot more. You think about consequences a lot more.