Professor Lloyd Llewellyn-Jones

And I've seen them out on the White Sands Missile Range, which is actually quite close to the White Sands Archaeological Site, which I think we've talked about, where we have these human footprints. There's mammoth footprints all over the place. Yeah. I had to have them point it out to me that these are mammoth footprints.

I mean, to me, they look, well, they look like large round patterns on the landscape. Okay, I'll buy it that those are mammoth footprints. They look like other kinds of geological features to me, but smarter people than me assured me that they were footprints and I was happy to go along with that.

I mean, to me, they look, well, they look like large round patterns on the landscape. Okay, I'll buy it that those are mammoth footprints. They look like other kinds of geological features to me, but smarter people than me assured me that they were footprints and I was happy to go along with that.

I mean, to me, they look, well, they look like large round patterns on the landscape. Okay, I'll buy it that those are mammoth footprints. They look like other kinds of geological features to me, but smarter people than me assured me that they were footprints and I was happy to go along with that.

whether they were mammoths of, well, they were probably Colombian mammoths, just given the range and where they were found.

whether they were mammoths of, well, they were probably Colombian mammoths, just given the range and where they were found.

whether they were mammoths of, well, they were probably Colombian mammoths, just given the range and where they were found.

And there's been a certain amount of arguing about the number of taxa of mammoths, but generally at the moment, we're going with just those two.

And there's been a certain amount of arguing about the number of taxa of mammoths, but generally at the moment, we're going with just those two.

And there's been a certain amount of arguing about the number of taxa of mammoths, but generally at the moment, we're going with just those two.

That's the big question, isn't it? There's been a debate for over a century as to whether humans were responsible for their extinction. And the challenge and the complication here is that we actually have very little evidence that humans were actively preying upon these species. We do know that they did.

That's the big question, isn't it? There's been a debate for over a century as to whether humans were responsible for their extinction. And the challenge and the complication here is that we actually have very little evidence that humans were actively preying upon these species. We do know that they did.

That's the big question, isn't it? There's been a debate for over a century as to whether humans were responsible for their extinction. And the challenge and the complication here is that we actually have very little evidence that humans were actively preying upon these species. We do know that they did.

We have, you know, a dozen or more sites where we have evidence of human artifacts, mammoth bones, suggesting that there was some sort of activity going on there. But in some of those cases, it looks like humans were simply scavenging already dead animals. We can actually see primarchs where they were sort of pulling apart bones to sort of gnaw on them, I suppose.

We have, you know, a dozen or more sites where we have evidence of human artifacts, mammoth bones, suggesting that there was some sort of activity going on there. But in some of those cases, it looks like humans were simply scavenging already dead animals. We can actually see primarchs where they were sort of pulling apart bones to sort of gnaw on them, I suppose.

We have, you know, a dozen or more sites where we have evidence of human artifacts, mammoth bones, suggesting that there was some sort of activity going on there. But in some of those cases, it looks like humans were simply scavenging already dead animals. We can actually see primarchs where they were sort of pulling apart bones to sort of gnaw on them, I suppose.

So yeah, humans had an effect, but was it consequential or not? And it's also important to note, and we perhaps mentioned this in our past conversations, that mammoths were simply one of over three dozen animals that will go extinct at the end of the Pleistocene. And what makes this challenging, of course, is that it was the end of the Pleistocene.

So yeah, humans had an effect, but was it consequential or not? And it's also important to note, and we perhaps mentioned this in our past conversations, that mammoths were simply one of over three dozen animals that will go extinct at the end of the Pleistocene. And what makes this challenging, of course, is that it was the end of the Pleistocene.

So yeah, humans had an effect, but was it consequential or not? And it's also important to note, and we perhaps mentioned this in our past conversations, that mammoths were simply one of over three dozen animals that will go extinct at the end of the Pleistocene. And what makes this challenging, of course, is that it was the end of the Pleistocene.

So we have this confluence of animals disappearing, humans arriving, and all the massive changes that are taking place in the climate and the environment as the Ice Age comes to an end. So it's not entirely clear which way are the causal arrows pointing. Are they pointing at humans being responsible for all of these changes? Or in my view, more likely, are we looking at