Rachel Abrams

In other words, just because you say, okay, we're going to give you the money to hire 10 new people, 100 new people, that does not mean that you have 10 or 100 new people that are ready tomorrow to take a job at Newark, one of the busiest airports in the country. That's right.

In other words, just because you say, okay, we're going to give you the money to hire 10 new people, 100 new people, that does not mean that you have 10 or 100 new people that are ready tomorrow to take a job at Newark, one of the busiest airports in the country. That's right.

But wait, initially they said that they needed 60-something controllers, and now the FAA is saying they only need 42. Why did they change that?

But wait, initially they said that they needed 60-something controllers, and now the FAA is saying they only need 42. Why did they change that?

So basically what you're saying is that at the time of this outage, they had a third of the people that they actually need to run air traffic control at a super busy time at Newark. Yeah, under normal staffing guidelines, that's what they would have. Given the numbers of the air traffic controllers that are actually working at Newark, is there a safe number of flights that can fly in and out?

So basically what you're saying is that at the time of this outage, they had a third of the people that they actually need to run air traffic control at a super busy time at Newark. Yeah, under normal staffing guidelines, that's what they would have. Given the numbers of the air traffic controllers that are actually working at Newark, is there a safe number of flights that can fly in and out?

Like, how many planes ideally should be going in and out of that airport if there's only four people who are working at any given time?

Like, how many planes ideally should be going in and out of that airport if there's only four people who are working at any given time?

This math doesn't work. So then what's the role of the government here? Like, at what point is the FAA supposed to come in and say, this is not safe. You can't fly. You do not have enough people for these planes to land and take off safely. Like, isn't that the whole point of the FAA?

This math doesn't work. So then what's the role of the government here? Like, at what point is the FAA supposed to come in and say, this is not safe. You can't fly. You do not have enough people for these planes to land and take off safely. Like, isn't that the whole point of the FAA?

Okay, so just to be clear, we know there have come points where the FAA has said, these conditions are not safe, you're not allowed to fly. And we know that that hasn't happened at Newark, but we don't actually know where the line is. Do I have that right? You do.

Okay, so just to be clear, we know there have come points where the FAA has said, these conditions are not safe, you're not allowed to fly. And we know that that hasn't happened at Newark, but we don't actually know where the line is. Do I have that right? You do.

So given the fact that the FAA isn't actually pulling the emergency brake, people can't just be expected to continue with the status quo at Newark, right? So is anybody proposing any kind of solutions?

So given the fact that the FAA isn't actually pulling the emergency brake, people can't just be expected to continue with the status quo at Newark, right? So is anybody proposing any kind of solutions?

Kate, I feel like as journalists, when you see a major failure like what happened at Newark within a system that more broadly we know has problems, I feel like our first instincts is to assume this is probably not the only really big problem here. And so I guess the question becomes, are there more Newarks around the country?

Kate, I feel like as journalists, when you see a major failure like what happened at Newark within a system that more broadly we know has problems, I feel like our first instincts is to assume this is probably not the only really big problem here. And so I guess the question becomes, are there more Newarks around the country?

But it's a very valid question. I mean, it's sort of interesting to note here that in the past, if you were a nervous flyer, you were sort of treated as a bit irrational because everybody would say, oh, it's so safe. It's much more dangerous to be in a car. But now it feels like to be nervous is normal just from reading the news, right?

But it's a very valid question. I mean, it's sort of interesting to note here that in the past, if you were a nervous flyer, you were sort of treated as a bit irrational because everybody would say, oh, it's so safe. It's much more dangerous to be in a car. But now it feels like to be nervous is normal just from reading the news, right?

Right. As nerve-wracking as it is to maybe read the news and maybe to listen to this episode, it's still probably important to remember that air travel still remains overwhelmingly safe and, frankly, probably still much safer than getting in a car.

Right. As nerve-wracking as it is to maybe read the news and maybe to listen to this episode, it's still probably important to remember that air travel still remains overwhelmingly safe and, frankly, probably still much safer than getting in a car.