Richard Arnold

So there'll be a few more things announced on Budget Day for sure.

Okay.

The hard calls that we got last week, social housing, public servants, et cetera, that doesn't feel or sound like a traditional election year party promise, does it?

Well, it's pretty clear at the beginning of the year you can't have a lolly scramble in the financial straits that we're in at the moment, and we're working our way through that.

But on the public sector changes and reforms we want there, there genuinely is, after 30 to 40 years, so many government agencies and ministries that have built up.

I've actually mapped them all out on A3 sheet of paper and

So there's a lot of them, right?

And then you look at Finland, I look at Singapore, I look at Ireland, those three in particular.

And so we know that there's a lot of duplication and some of it doesn't make a lot of sense in the way that it's all hung together.

It's just been a victim of history.

So you've got to streamline that.

Secondly, technology is a huge enabler for us to deliver much better service to the public with more effective service.

and then a more efficient, streamlined place, and actually building a place that's future-proofed.

I mean, imagine what the public service of 2040 is going to look like.

Well, we should start that job rather than keeping the one that we've got from 1990.

Explain to me the scrappet that was underway last week with Peters and MFAT.

Why the down to 1%?

Why the savings of $2.whatever billion it is?

Why not just give people what they need or don't need?

See, I would argue personally—I'm not an expert, but I would argue personally—