Rory Stewart

Being fired at Iran.

Right.

And he gets to play every which way.

He can be like, this is what you should do.

And meanwhile, under the table, Putin can screw him over.

Exactly.

Yeah.

It's such a sign of desperation and weakness, though.

Churchill did point to this, the example before the war.

were some of his colleagues absolutely desperate to try to get Mussolini's advice on how to deal with Hitler and hoping that if they were nice to Mussolini in Abyssinia, he'd somehow help them against Hitler.

And Churchill was saying consistently, you're out of your mind.

It doesn't work like that.

Well, let's take a quick break.

And then I think what we should do maybe is come back to what's happening on the ground in Iran.

Because as I say, we tend to look at this from 10,000 feet and actually right at the heart of this is the experience of people in Iran at the moment.

Cool.

See you in a bit.

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