Ross Douthat

How would you say, just as obviously someone who works on these issues, you know, it's now been 1990.

Sorry, I'm going to do the math in my head.

It's been 35, 35, 35 years.

35, 35 years.

Yes.

So there's been probably infinite changes in the immigrant legal experience.

But, like, what are the biggest changes that you've observed between then and now?

And had you ever been involved in any kind of direct protests on immigration before the second Trump administration, before the last year?

That was the main political cause.

Okay.

So what happened after the last election?

What has it meant to turn your organization into a group that is active in helping people who want to protest?

Right.

Promises to do mass deportations.

Correct.

And do you use the term constitutional observer?

Yes, we do.

Okay, so what is a constitutional observer?

So let's say I call you up or I come to your offices and I say, I'm concerned about ICE's presence in Minneapolis.

I want to become a constitutional observer or I want to be trained in how to sort of be present at ICE actions.