Ryan Grim

The idea that all attention is net good I think is an interesting one because I remember thinking at the time if I were you guys and Kamala Harris was my candidate, I would actually not tell her.

To do Joe Rogan.

Yeah.

Because she might be okay in five minutes on MSNBC or CNN or even Fox, like a little pushback here and there.

But she didn't strike me as somebody that for an hour, an hour and a half is going to kind of win over the audience because that's just not the style that she's kind of come up in.

But I think, and I'm curious for your take on this, I think it has created...

a kind of obstacle course or litmus test of sorts for candidates.

That is actually a good thing that, that the new kind of bar that you have to clear to be a national candidate is, can you sit down for 90 minutes in a free form interview and

And come across as a normal person.

And I think Bernie did really well with that in 2016 and beyond.

Even though he just says the same thing, millionaires and billionaires.

I think AOC could do it.

Because she lives in that kind of...

She calls audibles all the time.

She's like... She's not that scripted.

Ro Khanna does it all the time.

He goes to these places.

Buttigieg could probably do it.

But like... Newsom can do it.

But I can imagine that some others couldn't.