Sam Bungey

But he just seems so open immediately when I met him.

And like I say, very...

very like affable and, and, you know, laughing straight away and he'd, you know, messing around and he was, he was, he just seemed so candid about everything and he was willing to like say this and that about other people I'd spoken to, you know, and he's very like, didn't hold back about what he thought about this person being a,

stooge for the Cuban government or whatever it was.

At the same time, as you spend more time with him, you realize kind of some of the reasons that he was good at his job, which is that he seems to be doing those things.

But there's a whole other part of this that he never goes beyond certain boundaries.

He's keeping you out of...

And also, he's not just talking to me for his own... He's got an agenda.

Yeah, sorry, you of course would be really used to it.

You know you're being, they want access to your platform.

But we have a lot of experience with people who you really have to look out for, that they aren't criminals or politicians or whoever.

They just don't understand how this is going to change their lives.

Not to talk about Wes Cork too much, but Ian Bailey, I feel like, despite all his...

I think he was very naive about how the media worked.

Like what he thought he was getting out of talking to people because he was so often totally stitched up after speaking to people.

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, that was sort of... A brief history of Cuba.

Jennifer was, like I say, when we kind of delved into that, the few trips you'd made to Cuba, just to say that our visas were denied twice, actually, during the production of this.

We obviously wanted to go there.

Even though the action had long since gone from Cuba, it was now in like...