Sam Harris

I mean, some of these people are very close to the technology.

Some of them are even, you know, developing the technology and, and at least, you know, Jan LeCun's case is one of the actual, you know, progenitors of the technology.

Uh, one of the three, you know, forefathers of it.

But there are people who are deeply informed about all of these facts and yet won't concede anything to the fears.

What is your theory of mind of these people?

Because some of them are in the film and they're given the job of providing the other side of the story here.

Doomers is a term of disparagement launched by the people who don't share these fears.

So let's not reify that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So then what do you make of the people who have all the facts in their heads, but they're not worried or claim to be not worried about

quite literally anything.

But there's an interesting case here.

So take someone who has finally had their religious epiphany here, but for the longest time didn't.

And this is literally the most informed person on earth, Jeffrey Hinton.

Mm-hmm.

How do you explain that these problems weren't obvious to him years ago?

So he was, he was somebody who didn't give really any credence to concerns about alignment that I'm aware of for years and years and years as he was quite literally the father of this technology.

Right.

And now he is, he, I mean, he's,