Sarah Longwell

Vance went there.

Bill, talk about what level of defeat this is for Trump and for J.D.

Vance.

Yeah, I mean, Bill, when you and I were starting out in our Trump opposition, right, you and I were the OGs together.

And we were, you know, working ourselves up about what we could do.

And we started going, you know, trying to learn more about the environment.

It's when I started doing focus groups.

But it was also, I think, when I realized just how much Trump was part of a global phenomenon environment.

at the time, in large part, I think at its most basic level, there's all kinds of things that feed into this, but at its most basic level, it seemed to be a bit of an authoritarian backlash against mass migration to a lot of different countries, right, and including ours.

I do wonder now if, you know, we're 10 years on here, they were 16 years on in Hungary, because remember, these are people who voted for Orban in the first place, just the way people here voted for Trump.

But

The economic stagnation that is basically post-COVID that caused the inflationary environment that ended up getting Joe Biden, right?

He was part of the incumbent wave where sort of all the incumbents lost in that post-COVID inflationary environment.

Is it possible, though, that we are at the beginning of a global backlash around

to the competitive authoritarianism of Orban that is basically like, okay, we tried you guys out, you authoritarians, and actually all we got for it was a ton of corruption, which by the way, that is another lesson I would really like to point out.

I think in this country, this is also what happened in Russia.

Like the way that you can get at a lot of these leaders, and Trump, this is another place where he borrows the playbook almost exactly, which is how to be completely corrupt and give everything out to your buddies and enrich them and enrich yourself.

But is it possible that this is a beginning of a global backlash against these corrupt authoritarians?

Yeah.

I mean-