Sarah Paine

And the North is just sitting with its timeout and being more and more malign at home.

But it's more like that.

It's

of not recognizing, for instance, conquests.

And this is what went on actually when Stalin took over the Baltic states.

We never recognized that.

In fact, they ran governments in exile based on the funds that they're... I think, oh yeah, there were Baltic states had their funds in U.S.

banks.

So when Stalin overran them, I think those funds became what funded their embassies.

And so N generations later...

we recognize their independence.

These things are not solved on anyone's watch.

The way the last Cold War ended is because the Chinese and Russians changed their minds.

You have to wait for others to come to their own decisions.

You know, I don't know the answer, and I'm working on an edited book with a wonderful colleague who knows much more about economics than I do, and we have all kinds of chapters.

This book will not be a good read, because you want to learn things.

And so I've done a lot of edited books to learn things, different kinds of naval operations, and then they feed into the books that are more overarching.

But this one's on sanctions, and we're in the process of writing the concluding chapter now.

And the things that you're bringing up, sanctions don't seem to make people do what you want them to do.

And so a lot of people go, well, they don't work.