Sat Shaw

And the thing about Pedersen, which has been so bewildering in so many different ways, that the first three years in the National Hockey League, his production based on his age and games played was among some of the best that we've seen.

in the modern era of the National Hockey League.

Not quite at the level of the Sidney Crosbys and McDavids and whatnot, but not that far off in terms of a young player coming in and having a big impact right away.

So you saw the height being almost as high as it can get early on in his career.

And he had a dip in the past.

And I think what you could point to is he did have that...

trouble spot between the north division year and the year afterwards where his game really fell apart and we all kind of wondered what happened to ep40 and then he figured it out then he had the 100 point season afterwards and he really pushed his game forward so i guess you could always sell that we've seen this in the past and with maturity and with a better situation we know we can bounce back and is there an organization that's that's needy enough down the middle

that might be somewhat depleted in their assets or be in a position where they're willing to roll the dice on taking the upside.

And that, to me, it's two teams.

It's either two teams.

Potentially.

Or a rebuilding team, right?

Or a team that's on the cusp, that has some cap space, doesn't have a lot else to offer, but willing to take that type of risk.

So it's a win-now team that only has a few cards to play or a team that has a long-term approach.

Totally.

I think more than anything else, you need one elite asset.

More than anything else.

Now, obviously, you want the multiple first-round picks.

But the first-round picks, to me, are always interesting because if you're trading them to a contender, generally speaking, even if you get two or three, if that team stays in the playoffs, we're talking 20s and late 20s.

And that's helpful, but it's usually not a spot where you're finding...