Savan Kotecha
Appearances
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it was like, that's what they thought I did for a living all of a sudden. But yeah, it was a tough one. You know, there were times where like I, because I was raised in this big Indian community where I would avoid going to like the grocery store after high school because I was like the loser in my parents' house writing songs when like all my friends went to college and did other things.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I meet Simon Cowell when I'm like 19 years old. They weren't screaming for the winner of X Factor. They were screaming for One Direction.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I had no idea if this thing was going to work out. And every, you know, if I went to the grocery store and I saw like an Indian auntie, they would like lecture me about what I'm doing with my life. So I just avoided places where I knew family, friends would be and things like that for a while because it was just,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
you know, it was, it was, it was mentally is pretty tough to sort of feel like the black sheep of a community that raised you, you know, but then there you go. It worked out.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
No, next part of the story was Sweden. So I signed my first publishing deal. This is like 1999 or 2000s. And they were like, go to Sweden. This is where all the pop music is happening. Don't go to LA. I had yet to meet another songwriter in my life.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I did everything by myself on Cakewalk on a PC. And they sent me to Sweden for a writing trip. At first, you know, there was a company called Merlin. So there was Cheron with Max and Dennis Pop and all these people, and they did all those songs.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We have Ariana Grande. Do you know who she is? And I started singing, one more time. When you have those gifts that she has, anything felt possible. And when we got his vocal, it was like, oh shit. It's like Michael Jackson, you know? I didn't know what I was doing. I didn't understand why my kids wanted to hug me.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then there was a company called Merlin, which basically, so if Cheron did like Britney Spears and Backstreet Boys, Merlin would do like 98 Degrees and Jessica Simpson. So whatever, like, you know. And record labels were giving any Swedish producer like... like four or five song deals or album deals because they were like, there's something in the water in Sweden. We have to be a part of it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So at the time, BMG was talking to Merlin to be their admin administrator. I think they ended up going to Universal at the end, but they were like, oh, we have this new kid. They're like, oh, send them to Sweden. And I'd never been anywhere other than the UK and America. So I'd never like, you know, they sent me to Sweden.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I just, you know, the first songwriter I met there, the guy from BMG picks me up from the hotel and he goes, I want to introduce you to a couple of writers and producers. So the first writer he introduced me to was a guy named Red One. Wow. Wow. And Red introduced me to some of his friends. Again, broke Ryder at the time.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I started getting, you know, collaborations in Sweden and like I would get cuts like in Europe. And I like had a hit in like Denmark or had a hit and, you know, and then BMG was like, oh, this is going good. So every time I go back to the States, after a few months, they'd send me back to Sweden.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And eventually one of my friends there who was part of Red One's team at the time was like, hey, why do you keep going back? Cause it's like pre nine 11. So I had an American passport. He's like, you don't need to go back all the time. If you're keep complaining, when you go back, I would, you know, miserable, you're writing by yourself.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I started making friends in Sweden and other songwriters. So when you find, when you finally meet people who have like similar interests as yours, like, Oh my God, this is amazing. It's like, I found my home. And, um, I was like, yeah, I don't need to go back, I guess. And he was like, yeah, let me just go to the immigration office.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He took me to the immigration office back then, again, pre 9-11, American passport right away. They give you a visa. I didn't have any money, though. I had very little money. So I slept on Red's. Red had a studio apartment half the size of this room. I'm not kidding you. He had a cot and I slept on the floor for like six months. And both broke riders, you know, trying to make it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
That's how messed up my thinking was, this sort of intertwinement of self-worth and achievement. A friend pushed me to get into therapy and save my life, to be honest with you.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And when I had no money, when I was like, oh crap, I have no place to live. Because they don't rent you apartments in Sweden. It's always like secondhand, you know? So if you couldn't find anything, I would go to London and I'd stay with my relatives. in London. And one of the trips I was in London and BMG calls me up and they said, listen, you should do some A&R meetings here.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was like, great, I'll do some A&R meetings here. And it was like, there's one guy who's a bit, one of the biggest pop A&Rs. He's got a couple of boy bands that are coming out that are going to be big. Call Simon Cowell. You should go meet him. This is pre-idol or anything like that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So I go and I meet Simon Cowell when I'm like 19 years old. My first day in our meeting was Simon Cowell. That's crazy. And he remembers this a little bit as well. And he, from that day onwards, became like an angel on my shoulder because So he had a huge boy band called Westlife. And he didn't cut my songs right away.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But I think a year or two later, of always listening to what I had, he started cutting my songs on Westlife. And that was a huge break for me. Because Westlife, many Americans don't know this, but Westlife outside America, when the boy band, when that pop boom died in America, Westlife was going strong in the rest of the world, selling records.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
millions of albums and Simon you know people know him as a television producer but he or like a judge before he was he was the best A&R pop A&R person in in Europe like everything Simon Cowell touched sold records it was always cheesy pop it wasn't like the cool stuff but I was like I love that stuff so I just became one of Simon's guys and I was in Sweden and and he would send artists and I would write songs for Simon's acts with a lot of the Swedish producers I befriended
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And yeah, and that's how I got my sort of big break because I was having hits all over, like multiple hits a year in the UK and Europe with Simon Cowell. And then X Factor happened sort of after we had a long, you know, relationship. He, I think, I think if I remember correctly, a DJ got us falling in love.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And If You Seek Amy happened for me because by then I started working with Max once in a while. And he, yeah, he asked me if I would do X Factor. He's like, I don't know, Simon, because I previously worked with a lot of the winners and stuff like that. He's like, I don't know, Simon, I'm starting to have hits outside America. I was, I was...
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
trying to like separate myself from the UK cheesy pop I was doing. Cause I wanted to finally do, I was finally getting like the calls to do like cooler American stuff. And, um, and he goes, she was Savannah, just go meet the contestants, you know? And I went to London. I was like, okay. Cause I owed Simon so much. I go meet the contestants and share a Lloyd walks in.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, Oh, that's something. And then these five kids walk in. And what I noticed when the kids walk in is that for the rest of the contestants, they had sort of got me like this meeting room where like I had 30 minutes with each contestant. That's what we did just to get to know them and see if anything inspires me.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And Cher inspired me, but it was always like the artists would go in by themselves. But when these five boys walked in, I noticed that all the women from the office walked, came in the room as well. I was like, oh, that's interesting. And they had, they were the funniest kids. You know, they had known me from some of my songs like Westlife that they grew up with because they were UK and Ireland.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And like, oh my God, you did these songs. And I thought they were just the best kids. And I was like, they have something. And it was One Direction. And yeah. And then I did X Factor that year, which was the funnest three months. I mean, I've made lifelong friends from the people that worked on that show. And yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was, so we tried to find a role for me. So we made it like vocal producer so I could help mold them and on air as well. But like, it was really, I tried not to be on air. I put on stupid wigs throughout the series.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was thinking there never, no way they're going to put this in the edit, but they did.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
you're also very good at accents I saw you do a couple accents like Niles accent oh yeah we did a lot of fun like behind the scenes comedy sketches and stuff and for the four finalists or the five finalists we did like we did like I wrote comedy songs for them like for One Direction it was What's Happening Boys um And I just fell in love with those guys and that whole process.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then when it was over, it was like, okay, you know, I'd go on tour a little bit and with the X Factor tour, because I was assigned, I started working for Psycho for Simon's label. So I was assigned the Cher Lloyd album to make and then I was supposed to advise for One Direction. And then Cher happened and then one day lightning struck and What Makes You Beautiful was written.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and you know first i think up all night was the first one to just get it going and um and yeah and and one what makes you beautiful happens we didn't really know it's interesting like i wrote it for my wife um and i didn't really i knew it was correct the song you know what i mean like um when we wrote it you know i had that phrase and a bit of the start of the chorus melody and carl and rami were playing with chords and stuff and
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I went out of the room and listened to some voice notes and I had... And then I read it that morning. I had written down on my phone from something my wife had said. Like I wrote down like, oh, you're beautiful. You don't know you're beautiful. That's what makes you beautiful. And started singing that along to whatever the chords were, just, you know.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And when it was done, I mean, I tweaked it a little bit in New York and, like, there were, you know, before the boys went to hear it. But I don't think any of us realized, like, oh, it was going to be this thing, you know. And I remember, like... Yeah, I think because even though the label wanted me to change some of the lyrics, you know, the what makes you beautiful part.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, no, no, no. I think we're so used to Westlife singing these songs. But I think a new generation of kids aren't used to that. You know, and they're luckily at the end, they agreed. And I remember being at I ended up doing X Factor America. And I remember being at the viewing party when Steve Barnett and Rob Stringer were there. who at the time were the heads of Columbia in America.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And they both, I knew them for a while and we're pretty close. They both came up to me like, what makes you beautiful is gonna be huge. I was like, you think? Like I had no thought of it's gonna be huge in America. We just knew the band was special.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, definitely. I find that with most of the things that have worked for me, even the ones that you wouldn't expect, they're like the sexy songs where there's always like a grain of truth in it. And What Makes You Beautiful, yeah, it was written about my wife.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
When I met my wife, it was one of the first, it was when I went to Sweden during one of those trips and some friends convinced me to go to a bar. I never really went to bars before. And I saw her walk in. I was my back was facing the door and a bunch of people walked in. I just saw the people I was with sitting across from them. They like waved at people.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I turned around and I saw a bunch of people. I was like, who's that? We went to school with them. And then I looked back again and I saw my wife. I didn't see my wife's face until she flipped her hair. Hence the way that you flip your hair. And I saw my wife was like and they were like, you know, we could go talk to them if you want. I never had a girlfriend before in my life.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
My wife's my first only girlfriend ever. and because I wasn't allowed to date I'm from a very traditional Indian family not that girls were like knocking down my door by the way but yeah so it was a really special night for me and and luckily it came together in that song you know
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, I mean, and by the way, that's sort of the early days, the first two albums. But it was, yeah, it was part of it. It was amazing. It was an amazing process to be a part of that, to be part of something early on from the get-go, really. And to see, like... the fan base forming, it was, it became this sort of like, um, it became its own thing. It's hard to explain.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, you know, there was a group of us on X factor who were really like, you know, making sure that, okay, make sure it's guitar pop cause they don't dance. And like, there was all of that. Um, there were just great kids. They were really funny, great kids. And it was just a pleasure and something I'm really proud of. And, um,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And yeah, it was, it was an amazing time, you know, and, um, eventually they moved on. They need, they wanted to grow musically and all that. And they moved on for me, but like, it's, it's something so special and I still love those guys. You know, I'm still in touch with a lot of them and it's amazing to see what they did after, you know, they really earned it. And, um,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And yeah, it's so funny when I'm with Simon or any other people on the show, we just reminisce about those days and how like, you know, they didn't win X Factor, but every time that every week that went by, like crowds around the studio grew and grew and grew and grew until it became this pandemonium, even at the rehearsal places. And they weren't screaming for the winner of X Factor.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
They were screaming for One Direction. And it was just an amazing thing because I got into pop music as well, like loving boy bands. Like my sister was quite introverted when she grew up and until New Kids on the Block happened. And then New Kids on the Block happened. And I remember this, that all of a sudden she had friends around because like it gave them something in common.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, common interests. And it always meant more to me than just like, oh, a cheesy boy band. It always meant more like, hey, this is important for a very important time in people's lives, you know, that shape a lot of them in their life. And you could be the introverted girl or the girl with not many friends or the popular girl.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
This all of a sudden gives you something in common with everyone else. It's very true. And it's more than just music, you know? And I think that's really, I've always wanted to be, that's the power of pop music. And I've always wanted to be a part of that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So for me, it was, you know, finally, I felt like it was fulfilling sort of this dream or this destiny that I, of why I got, why I love pop music in the first place.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
if you seek amy dj god's falling in love um one more night room five then on to what makes you beautiful uh live while we're young um can't feel my face love me like you do uh problem bang bang love me harder one last time no tears left to cry god is a woman um gosh i'm forgetting stuff
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So, Yeah, we went, so I was in the bathroom. I tell the story a lot. I was in the bathroom at the Royal Garden Hotel in the UK. Shout out to the Royal Garden. My wife was on the other side of the wall. We had just gotten married before, some months before. And she was just like fixing her hair. I was like, oh, I feel so ugly today. I was like, oh, you're so beautiful.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You don't know you're beautiful. And I wrote that line down. I had called Carl and Rami. So I'd done a couple of songs for the boys, like, up all night. And I was helping put together the album, getting other writers and producers interested in the band, which was tricky at first because a lot of people were like, oh, I don't want to do a boy band, you know. And...
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So I asked my good friends, Carl and Rami. So Carl Falk, who I earlier in my career, I did a lot of Westlife songs with and a few Westlife hits with. I hadn't worked with him in a minute. And Rami Yacoub, who became one of my close friends. We did a lot of Simon Cowell stuff together, Shane Ward and a few other things that if you live in the UK, you'd know.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I hadn't worked with them in a minute and they started working together. And I called them up and I was like, look, I need your help with this. You know, I just knew instinctively Carl had, you know, I mean, Rami is old school. Rami produced Hit Me Baby One More Time, wrote It's Gonna Be Me, a lot of the Backstreet stuff. He was part of Cheron.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I just had instinctively felt that they would be the right people to do this with. And I kind of told them the direction, look, we need to make a guitar pop. We're going to make it fun. And we've got to figure out how to do it where it's not trying to be cool. And they started, you know, Carl's an amazing musician, started jamming around with riffs and chords and couldn't figure out anything.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I stepped out of the room, went through my voice notes, which I do because I always record melodies all the time in my voice notes. And I found, it was something like that. I've got it somewhere in one of my old phones. And, you know, started singing that along to what Carl was doing. I was like, I think I have something. And then, yeah, I just developed from there.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I went behind the mic and started singing. Um, I've got the demo in my computer, um, the original demo.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. I'll show it to you later. Yeah. I've got with my vocal and it has a few different lyrics on there. Cause the day before One Direction recorded, I was with Cher Lloyd in New York. Um, and I was like tweaking lines of what makes you beautiful to send off to Karl Rahm and said, replace these lines, like the flip your hair and a few other things. Um,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and um i woke up and i they were recording the next day in sweden and i was going to come the day after um so i missed the original day that they were hearing the song but i woke up to a text from harry going i think you really nailed it with this one and and i was like really and he goes yeah and that was what makes you beautiful i still have the text somewhere as well that's amazing um one of the other songs i love by one direction is is one thing yeah how did that song come about
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So that was me, Carl, and Rami again. One thing was actually two different songs.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So we had this, I wish I had those demos. Carl has them in his computer. We had... And then we had like some other, I think we had, tell me what to do now. And that was it. We can never crack the chorus. And I'm always one of those people, I start with the chorus first. And I feel like if you don't crack the chorus, it's like you have nothing. And then we had this other idea.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We had that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And we couldn't crack either. And I just remember we were spending days and days on these melodies, tweaking the melodies because we knew the melodies had to be as flawless as they could be. And I remember walking up in Stockholm, this street called Jortgatan. And I remember walking up, talking to my wife how I'm so stuck on these songs. And I played her voice notes.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then in walking and playing the voice notes, I was like, oh, wait. But that chorus works on this. And I called Rami and Carl. I think one of them, one of them picked up. They're like, oh, yeah, that makes sense. Let's try that on Monday. And then we tried it and it became one thing. That's one of my favorites as well.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Actually, I thought that was better than What Makes You Beautiful when we wrote it, because that made more sense to me as like, yeah, this is really hooky.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, that was the game changer. I actually remember sitting with Max before One Direction and I was really frustrated because I started having hits. I started being a pretty reliable songwriter. Most everything I wrote, because I was so in Simon Cowell world with Westlife and all those things, I was selling a lot of records and having hits in the UK.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then I started working with Max and he was bringing me on things that he was working on.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
one ended up being if you see came in and DJ and I remember just going like gosh like I feel like when I go to LA I started doing writing trips to LA and I was like my contemporaries who don't have as much success as I do are in like rooms with you know this is years ago so Christina Aguilera Whitney Houston and all these people I can't get in those rooms and he goes well he goes man like he said something really important to me which was like that's because like you haven't broke anything
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He goes, trust me, when you break something, that's when it changes. He goes, right now you're having hits with people that would have hits regardless if you were working with them. Like Britney Spears is going to have hits regardless if you were a part of If You Seek Amy. Like I'd be giving her stuff, Luke would be, you know.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And Usher was going to have hits whether we had DJ Gals falling in love or not. And he goes, when you break something, it changes everything. And that always stuck with me. And then, you know, weirdly, it was actually Cher Lloyd and One Direction together because we had Want You Back for Cher Lloyd. And the industry saw that those two as like my projects.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, obviously there's a team of people involved, but, you know, I was spearheading that and and that changed everything. I mean, look, it wasn't like artists were calling me going like, you know, I want a song like What Makes You Feelful. It was more that the gatekeepers, like the label heads and A&Rs were like, oh, you're a rainmaker. Like come in and solve these problem projects for us.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, that was that was sort of the thing. And it just opened up. It one, it was a confidence booster for sure, because I realized, oh, that's what I'm probably best at. Like cracking, cracking a code and putting the right creatives around the code and cracking it. And that's what I ended up like being a part of moving forward after sort of One Direction was done for me, you know.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I have not. It makes me so happy.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Amazing. Cher was such a talent. I mean, she was such a... She had such presence and star power. Yeah. And it was really, it was my first time A&Ring something.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So like, you know, it was weird because that one is the one that broke in the States, but in England, it was another song that I didn't write, which was so like a thing of pride for me because I wanted to make sure like, I don't want it to be like a song that breaks or that I wrote. I really want to A&R this, you know?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And she had a number one in the UK with something I didn't write, which I think also helped though, this whole thing of like, oh, you're a rainmaker. We know that you're not going to, have like an agenda that you're only pushing your songs. Because if anything, I've talked myself out of singles a number of times. Interesting. Because I just believe that the best song should win.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I don't believe in selling a song. You know what I mean? Yeah. Because I've been behind the desk now and I saw during those years, I saw it's like hard to find a hit song. No one's trying to put out a bad song. Do you know what I mean? Like you are the people, there's so much involved and making those decisions. It is all with the best intentions of thinking that it's the best song.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So I, you know, again, like, you know, a lot of writers would be like, oh, I didn't get the first single. It's politics. It's blah, blah, blah. It's like, I really like have empathy for the other side having been there that no, no, it's not actually. It's like you are trying, whether the public agrees or whether you agree with it, like you are trying to find the best song. Do you know what I mean?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And so it made me approach songwriting in a different way. Like I think of songwriting like A&Ring. And if I don't have the best song, I'll be the first one to tell the label that, yeah, maybe that's not the best one or like that one's better than mine, you know?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Well, that one I have to give a nod mostly to Shellback. Like he had that idea and thankfully was willing to work on it with me and let it be for my artist that I was working on, you know, because he was like him, you know, him and Max were on a roll. He could have, you know, and yeah, he was the catalyst of that one.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And he just, Cher brought the personality obviously, but he was like, he had that idea and it was like,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
In a roundabout way. Yeah. I didn't know what I was doing when I was writing songs. So I remember like, you know, I'm from a very traditional Indian family. Like music was not something that was an option for me. And when I started writing songs, it was literally, we just moved to Austin. I didn't have a bedroom.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, one is nothing is more important than the song, meaning that you do whatever. I mean, that's, that's his gift. He's such a good collaborator, right? You do whatever you got to do, whether it's bringing someone else in or whatever you, the song is the most, the song is a North star, whatever makes the song egos don't matter. None of that matters. We all start with a blank page.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We're all equal playing field when we start writing a song. Um, and the song is the most important thing. Um, that's one. Um, the other is Melody first. You know, I mean, I learned that from not only him, but like Christian Lundin, who was a part of Cheron, a lot of those guys that became mentors for me when my day's coming up, like melody is the universal language. That's really important.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, a lot of those oldest Cheron songs, they don't make any sense lyrically, but you don't realize that because the melody is so good. And the other was always let the song speak for itself. That's sort of what I was saying before. Don't hype the song to a label, whatever. Let the song speak for itself. If it's good enough, it's going to raise its hand because they want the best song.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So that was, I don't know if I'm allowed to say who, it was an attempt on another, for another artist. Got it. That ended up not taking the song, but it was sort of Max and Shellback started like this idea, started singing melodies and I was sitting next to them as well. Like, and I had this title DJ guys falling in love. So I like sort of, It was like, how about DJ God?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
DJ God's falling in love again with the synth line they were doing. It was sort of just, you know, that and getting the melodies right. And then I started writing the lyrics during that time. Because usually during those days with Max and Shellback, those early songs, I started with them. You know, a lot of times it would be like they had started like a melody thing.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It shifted later on, you know, and yeah. I wasn't sure after even coming up with that line, I was like, oh, is that good? Because I wasn't a fan. I'm not a fan of dance music. And so back then it was like, that was like one of the first like sort of dance songs that I did, that I was a part of. And I was like, I don't like dance music. So I was just like, is this good though?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was sleeping in like in the family room and everyone was going to sleep and I couldn't fall asleep. So I just took out my sister's old Yamaha keyboard and I just started like
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I don't know if it's good, you know? He's like, trust me, it's good. It's good. I was like, but let's change DJ Goswami to something else. No, no, that was great. That line was great. You know, spent a lot of time trying to make the lyrics and everything feel kind of cool. Because again, we were in Sweden doing like pop music. What we thought was...
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Like R&B and stuff like that was not what the Americans thought was R&B at the time. Even though I was American, it's still like I had been there long enough where I sort of became Swedish in that sense.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I remember the excitement for, you know, I was around Max Moore, so I don't know Shellback's reaction, but we were really excited that Usher was going to cut it, you know, because he had never worked with like an R&B, like a black artist before. Like it was always pop stuff, you know, and I'm a huge Usher fan. I mean, my gosh, like you make me want on all those.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It was like one of the dream, that was one of the dream cuts. And I remember us being at Conway and, And, you know, during that time, you never know, like if they, you know, someone says they're going to do some, the label says they're going to cut something and then things don't happen. So you just have to, by then I was also seasoned enough to know like, okay, don't get excited yet.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Don't get excited yet. And I remember we're at Conway and it's like, he shows up at 12 at night. And again, when we're there from like six in the evening, being told it's going to be six and then it's eight and then it's nine and then it's 12, you're thinking, oh, this isn't happening. And the next day, and to Usher's credit, by the way, who was the most amazing guy on the planet.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Usher's a great guy. He had a seven in the morning call time to be a mentor on American Idol. He doesn't show up to studio until 12 o'clock. So, and it's a really high key. So him and Max are playing, they play, he wanted to play Connect Four with Max for some reason. I remember that. And we're just sitting there like, you know, waiting for them to be finished. And then we're like, let's record.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
jamming on it with headphones on and i started figuring out chords and i started writing songs i didn't know what i was doing i was doing that every night while my parents and my sister would go to bed i would put on headphones and do that and started coming up with melodies stuff i didn't know what i like i just didn't know what i was doing but then i would watch like full house and i'd see like uncle jesse and he'd have a studio in the
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He's like, yeah, sure. So we go through the song and we're sitting there and the chorus is way too high for him.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Now it's like two in the morning and his assistant or someone is going in like, hey, guys, he's got a seven o'clock call time. And I was just like, you know, hey, let's just lower the key. And now it's like two in the morning. And we're like, you sure? He's like, yeah, come on, come on, let's go. I'll do it again. I'll do it again. I'll sing in the lower key.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And to his credit, he's such a trooper. We ended up finishing at four in the morning. He's such an incredible vocalist, first of all.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But he allowed us to lower the key and he re-sang it in the lower key. And apparently when he showed up for American Idol at seven on time, he was like the best mentor they had that season.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I mean, what a guy. I mean, at the time, though, we were like so scared that this wasn't going to happen because we were so excited that Usher was going to record our song. And then it ended up, you know, I remember when Pitbull got on, I think it was in Paris with my wife and I got the file, the MP3 with Pitbull's verse and the excitement of that was like, oh my gosh, amazing.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. I mean, I remember that song was probably the first time I felt like what a worldwide hit feels like.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. And I didn't even think about it back then because I never went out and stuff like that. So, yeah.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
so yeah no it's it was definitely like the yeah the feeling that feeling of like oh this is big like not the song but when it was out like and that feeling of what happens when you have like a global song um that became like the addiction so continuing on this run was maroon fives one more night was that with max as well Yeah. Um, I actually wrote, I was sent that idea here.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, when I was in this apartment actually. Um, and, um, yeah. And they had this idea, him and Shell back sent it to me and then I sent them like lyric ideas for that. And we just finished the song. And then, um, again, that was supposed to be for another artist, the same one that DJ was written for. Wow. And, uh, Maroon, uh, Adam loved it and cut it and same room as DJ and Conway.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, I think the last addition to that was to having Adam do that part. And yeah, there's another, another one. It was so exciting. Um,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
like that kind of happened around the same time one direction if i'm getting my years right um so it was an amazing sort of year for me like i helped break this band and then maroon five was like number one for like eight weeks um yeah it was it was it was such a great time during that time amazing
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it's really funny. I've actually said that to a few people and a friend of mine, a dear, dear friend named Eric Vitro, who's the most fantastic vocal coach on the planet. He works with every every major artist and he's really close to Stamos. So it's been one of my things ever since I made it.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It took a long time. I think Zedd sent the track and it was just trying to figure out what that, what it was, you know, like what the song was and what it was gonna say and feel like. And it was weird. I'm trying to remember during that time, I was so in like One Direction world, I think, and all of that, that like,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I just remember we, it took a while to get it done and get like the words right and get it all feeling right. Um, like song wise, um, that I barely recall. I wasn't there when I was in, I think I was in Sweden when Max was here recording Justin on it. And again, it was during a time where we're on such a like wave that like, it was just like, yeah, another one. You know what I mean?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Like it was, it was such a strange time. time to like now looking back i'm like gosh that all that all feels like a blur because i remember going to scooter's office and him showing me the video um and i was like wow that's really good and nikki's verse was amazing with the selena when we got those files back it was like
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
got Nicki Minaj on the song this is so cool you know it was at a time where it was like everything was sort of opening up for us all to not just doing like the standard pop stuff to do things where like a Nicki Minaj will jump on and like do you know do you know what I mean and like um Aaron Usher would record or like Maroon 5 would record you know like with those things were like all of a sudden opening up and to me I think I just remember being
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
so overwhelmed by excitement that all this stuff was happening. Like all the work put in on these songs, like Beauty and the Bee wasn't easy to write. It was like, you know, getting the phonetics and getting the like melodies and rhythm, like all those things, a lot of like time and care was spent.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So the fruits of that labor and all those things that I was around, you know, and learning from Max, the amount of work you put into the song was, Um, cause that's the thing with someone like him is that he also just works harder on every song than most people, you know, it's, it's, it's like, and that's what we did during our run after that.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We just worked on those songs like, and made them tried our best to make it as bull. Of course we can be wrong, but try our best to make it bulletproof to us as possible. Um, So every second felt like it mattered and didn't let go. We challenged each other and we kept trying to better everything in the song constantly.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Oh, that was No Problem was my first song.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I mean, gosh, what a gifted human and important person in my life. And collaboration with her was like game changing for me. I had just, it was very clear that I, I just moved to LA with, we just had our first kid. And it was very clear that One Direction was moving on from me. And I remember just being super heartbroken about that. You know, in hindsight, it was better for them.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
There was one time I had a friend who was mutual friends with Stamos and we were going to all have dinner and Stamos didn't show up. He was stuck on like Glee or one of those shows he was doing. I was so disappointed. And one day randomly I get a phone call from my friend Eric Vitro and I had a really shitty day. And I remember just waiting.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
They, you know, Julian Bonetta and those guys did an amazing job. Amazing. And, but it was, you know, it was being a part of that from the beginning was a tough thing to take, you know, just emotionally. And I was a bit of a funk writing wise. I think I had like,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
i think it's a bad writer's block for like six months we just moved here again so much life changes all these labels were throwing artists at me like they were throwing like their problem projects at me you know and um i remember carl and rami calling me one day they were in town and they're like hey we're in with david guetta I'll get to the Ari part in the story.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
When with David Guetta, come on, man, just come and write something with us. So David comes and he plays a chord progression, which then Carl adjusts. And at that time I was just so mentally blocked. I was literally just got behind the mic and I was begging the universe for one more hit. And I started singing.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And most of that melody was stream of consciousness, but I kept singing one more time. And it felt awesome. It was the first time I felt like I had written a good song in like a minute. And, you know, Rami came and he tweaked some things and Guetta didn't take it for his own. I was like, oh, fuck. You know, and I hadn't finished the lyrics fully yet.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So, but I had it in my back pocket and, um, I was doing more and more A&R meetings going, let me see what's out there. Let me just see what's around that inspires me. And one plane ride, I think I was coming from Austin or New York or something. I was sitting next to an old lady and I'm a Brown guy. So remember how weird this would be for the old lady. Um,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
an idea popped in my head and I just go, I was thinking yin yang twins. It's like, what if you had like a, a whisper song, but a girl singing a whisper song. Like if Mariah Carey had like the pre-chorus was like this huge melody and then you drop to a whisper. And I was got my phone and I'm like, I have that voice note somewhere. I've got,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was doing that thing of like sitting in my driveway, just trying to like get into the house and with a smile on my face because I've got two kids. So just sort of calming myself going through the day. And I had my phone pop since Eric calls. And I was like, OK, it's Eric. I got to pick up. Call. And I go, hey, Eric, how are you? And he goes, hey, man, I have someone who wants to talk to you.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. And you drop into like 808. And then like, I'm trying to figure out what a verse could be. And like, they knock on the door because I'm taking a long time. Like, everything okay in there, sir? And I step out. And as soon as I step out, I hear like, something like that should be the verse. So one more second, I close the door.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And, um, I had like the start of the verse melody and knew that, okay, big pre-chorus. And then you go into, I got one less problem without you. And I had that idea and I'd been trying to, you know, I was in sessions here and there, just working with different producers, trying to find my new crew in America. I tried that idea with a few other people and they
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
couldn't the because i'm you know now i can program a little bit but after my cakewalk days i never really programmed it was just i would i would describe what i want and i usually found my collaborators to be the people that understood what i was saying like carl falk was really good you mean something like this yeah exactly you know and i couldn't find that here because i was trying to describe no it would go into this like 808 like boom boom boom you know and um so during that time i'm meeting around that time i met uh wendy goldstein of republic
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
who I kind of knew a little bit before. And she goes to me, look, you know, I'd love you to do, we have Ariana Grande, do you know who she is? And she was like, she just had this hit, The Way, and we're trying to figure out what the next step is for her.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, I mean, yeah, I mean, I should meet her, you know, because we've got these Swedes are coming from, these new Swedes are coming from Sweden that Max had signed, like, and he was like, yeah, you can work with these guys. Why don't you try working with these guys? And they're coming in like two weeks. So if maybe that's a project for something I do with them.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So she sets up a meeting with me and Ariana and me and Ariana just bond right away. And we're talking music and she's talking about, I'd love to do something like Drake. And I had one last time. So I actually have a song because when the demo of that feels a little Drake-y and that, you know, I know what I know, what I know. Especially with me singing it, I guess. And she loved it.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
She's like, oh my God, I love that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I go, I also have this idea because you can sing like really, you have an amazing voice, right? Like you can do all the tricks. She was like, yeah, yeah. She was like, I was like, I have this idea where you do like, it's a whisper song, but we do like a big melody, a big, I didn't have it all there at the time. And she's like, yeah, I really liked the idea.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I go in and it goes like, I got one last problem with that. So Ilya flies in and I go to, and Max is like, you know, you should work with these guys, you know? And I was like, oh, you know, let's, I have this one idea, you know? And I told him the problem idea, you mean something like this? And the drop of the chorus was like, yes.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then we, and I started singing the verse melody, Max came in, we started fixing the melodies. And then, you know, I wrote the lyric and Ilya nailed the track and it became Problem. And Ari came and recorded that, recorded one last time.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I had another guy, two other guys from Sweden, one named Peter Svensson from the Cardigans and the guy named Mal Piyami started the idea for Love Me Harder, went in and we finished that. One of the dreams when I met Ari in my mind was to do a new Lady Marmalade. So I go to one of our guys, Rickard Goranson. I was like, can you start a track or something that's very like, think Lady Marmalade.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He started the track for Bang Bang. We came in and we wrote Bang Bang. And me and Max had Break Free, you know, really that's Max's melody on Break Free. And there was no lyric. And I was trying to crack the lyric for him for like a year, like genuinely, because every time you change the pronunciation of anything, Like it didn't feel as good.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then a second later, he's like, hey, it's John Stamos. Like, totally, like, everything that went wrong that day went away. And I was like, oh. And he was like, I hear you owe me some royalties. It was brilliant. That's incredible. Yeah. So, yeah, if Uncle Jesse wasn't, if Full House wasn't there, I wouldn't probably have been in the song. I wouldn't have known what I was doing.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I finally felt like I cracked it and it was sort of in our back pocket. And I was like, that'd be interesting. Like if Whitney Houston did break free, you know what I mean? And now we have Ariana Grande and she's just as good a singer. Like, and I played to Ari and she loved it.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, and so all of a sudden, like we had problem, bang, bang, love me harder, break free. And one last time.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, oh, shit, I'm back, baby. And it created this magic time for all of us, I think, where the universe was just dropping gems into my head in the middle of the night or in the shower. And Santa Tell Me came to me in the shower.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I started creating my own process of how I did things. I started figuring out, OK, if I write choruses and I write them a cappella,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
because the average person just listens to a when they're when you know when you have a song in your head you're not you don't have a backing track with it right you're singing it acapella so if it can be things so i always started i came up with this thing because i started realizing when i have these melodies that pop in my head they usually the big the strongest ones when they feel good acapella because like it's sing-alongable you know so i started using that as my sort of trick you know preparing for when artists come in just making sure i have a chorus or something like that
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So yeah, Let Me Harder was, you know, we just thought it was a great song when we wrote it, you know. Ali Payami, who's a sonic genius, started that track and it was a big break for him. I didn't know anything about The Weeknd. And Wendy Goldstein, it was her stroke of genius where she was like, you know, you know, I want to put The Weeknd on this. You know who The Weeknd is?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I just I didn't want to sound like I didn't. So I was like, yeah, I thought it was a band or he was a rapper. I genuinely thought that. So I didn't know what to expect when we got the vocal. And we just knew we loved the song. We really liked Love Me Harder a lot. And it was very understated. And we loved that. And when we got his vocal, it was like, oh, shit.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
This guy's like, it's like Michael Jackson, you know? Yeah. And and it was amazing when it worked. She called me after Wendy and said, hey, the weekend wants to work with you because, you know, he wants to like now have big hits. And it would be great if you guys could work, you know. And I was like, sure, you know, but Love Me Harder sort of started that relationship.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I think, you know, for him at the time, it was the biggest. I mean, he was obviously huge in this cult following and was able to tour. But as far as commercial hit pop song, that was the first big one. Amazing. And for his team also to feel what that felt like.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So, yeah, there you go.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Because when there's a difference between when you just have like a buzzy cool song and when you have like a real commercial big hit, you feel it in the atmosphere, you know. And that started off that relationship.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, in my early days, I wrote two songs. So I was friends. What was so weird was I had never met Ari before, but I was really good friends with Victoria Justice and I was really good friends with Avon Yogi from the show. That's crazy. And yeah, I did two songs, Best Friends Brother, and there was another one. Begging on Your Knees. Begging on Your Knees, yeah. For Victorious.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So it was like a kind of full circle moment that like, oh, this is so familiar that we know each other, you know? Yeah, it was, it was an amazing, it was such a, again, such a crazy time of, I think all of us, Amelia, Max, everyone, we together, we were like, it was just amazing. there was confidence, not arrogance, but there was confidence in our writing. And I was getting confident.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was, I was really, it sort of found my, I found my thing as a writer. Um, and, and with melodies, I started, I started finding my way of being really consistent with it away from like, just really cheesy or boy band pop, you know? And it was an amazing time, eight years. It was so intense. I mean, it was like the amount of work we put into those songs and challenging every minute of it.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I mean, I remember... when we were doing side to side, I tell the story a lot. Like we spent like two weeks on the pre-chorus melody of side to side. I know that sounds crazy to people, but we just knew, I knew what the chorus was because I knew what that was. And it was like, this is, you know, like this is something super special.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And we had the verse, had the verse melody, but I couldn't crack the chorus, the pre-chorus melody. We had pre-chorus melodies that were good and that would have probably worked. But it was again, this thing where we were all like, we put the bar so high for ourselves that like, No, it's not.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It doesn't make the chorus feel amazing because in my philosophy, and again, there's no one way of doing things, but especially at the time, it was always like the chorus is holy, you know, and the chorus is this holy thing. And if what comes, if it doesn't, if the chorus is great acapella, if you feel it's great acapella by itself.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then when you hear the whole song, the chorus doesn't feel right. That's, there's a problem before the chorus, you know? And, um, I was almost in tears, like pulling out my hair for the pre-course. And then a guy named Alexander Cronlin, who was a great Swedish songwriter, was visiting. And I could go, Alex, can you come in here? I've been working on this for two weeks.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I think Ilya has like five. 40 or 60 something versions of the pre-course in his computer that I was doing. It was like crazy. And, um, and I showed, we showed Alex what we were doing. I told him like, I did this, I tried this, just this theory. And he goes, what if you try something like that? Something like that. And he walked out of the room. I was like, you motherfucker.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And again, it goes back to the thing of the song is the most important thing, right? You know, whatever we have to do to make that the best thing we do, you know, pull people in, like get help, play it for people, get feedback, like from people you trust, obviously, you know? And, and yeah, and that's,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So Richard Joronson took the assignments and he started doing this rough track. And he had a bit of the verse melody. And then we just listened to it and loved it. And then me and Max just started singing melodies on it and jamming on it. Um, and we sort of played it for Ari and she liked what we were doing. And then we, um, and yeah, and I mean, that's, that's what it was.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then we were just, we all were there like jamming a little bit. And, um, after, after a while we just, you know, Max settled in and put it together, like structured it more, um, And it was such an exciting time. Again, we were just on this roll together and Ari was such a muse for great creativity. I really credit her for all of those songs in the sense that she was such a great muse for that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
When you have those gifts that she has and we knew we had those gifts at our disposal, Anything felt possible. And the label was, you know, amazing in such great support. And it was just all gears were running and you felt like, oh, it is possible to have a new Lady Marmalade. You know what I mean? Like it is possible to get that labels.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Awesome. Thanks. Yeah, it was, you know, I was pre-internet. So when I started making music, I had a boy band in high school. We called ourselves the Vocal Harmony Group. And I would start like writing songs. And after a while, they would be like, hey, let's just sing some of your songs. And they'd harmonize to my choruses.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, we'll get Jessie J on it and we'll get Nicki Minaj on it. And, you know, from where I was coming from, when I was taking scraps, you know, for years and years trying to break, to have that sort of arsenal and confidence from the people around, it was like amazing. Like anything was possible. And the song did what it did. And it's like become this sort of, it's like synced everywhere.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it's become like this.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and it yeah just an amazing it was an amazing time i guess that's the you know and it all stemmed from us jamming we were just he played us the track had a bit of it and we started jamming i've got voice notes of all of us in the room sort of jamming singing melodies you can hear ari in the background like that's fun um singing some of it and then you know the bang bang into the room i remember i have the voice note where i started singing that i had no idea what bang bang into the room meant but i just it felt good you know
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. It's so funny. Me and Ilya talk about that all the time because when we did it, it was, you know, if you remember, it wasn't the biggest hit when it was out. And we were actually really disappointed at the performance of the song again, because we were just used to everything going to like number one on radio and blah, blah, blah. Then Indie like peaked at number seven or eight on radio.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It wasn't like at the time, it wasn't like a massive hit. But what had happened, I guess, when the streaming era really took over, people started streaming it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And loving it. And that song, you know, we had talked about it with Ariana to do like, I don't know if you remember, we talked about doing like a acapella song. And Ilya went and started, he like layered his vocal of doing like, and then we started jamming on that, trying to like come up with something. It was like, ah. It doesn't work doing an acapella song.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I remember then he started like, okay, putting like a track together around that. And I remember just thinking, and this is how we approached a lot of songs at the time was like, okay, what haven't we heard before? Like what hasn't, you know, what hasn't Ari done before Whitney Houston or any of these amazing vocals. I've never heard them do like Michael Jackson-y kind of melodies.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And that was the idea was like, okay, let's write something super rhythmic like that over this amazing progression thing that Ilya had. And obviously with Ari's vocal, you can do that. And it just all sort of came together. I remember there was a different-ish verse melody that I had and Max sort of heard it through the walls and came in and he was like, hey, that's great.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I started making demos, just, you know, getting a tape deck and pushing record. And that's how I'd make demos. I knew nothing about music business and no connections or whatsoever. It was also around a time when like South by Southwest was sort of this indie music festival. Interesting. And I was living in Austin, but you don't go downtown when you're in high school in Austin. That's like.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It was like a longer phrase. That's something Max is so great at. And something I've learned actually from him is space. Like space is okay in a pop song. It's okay to have space. When you're writing, you want everything to be super active. You know what I mean? All the time. Because when you're writing it, space feels dull. Yeah. when you're in the room and you're singing ideas, right? For sure.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, and yeah, and it just came together and then, you know, and, and with the track and the producer thing, I mean, really Ilya and Max then took that and they spent like, I think two weeks on that production, like really honing it in. We, we had looked up our process on Into You, me and Ilya the other day. Um, and we realized the composition of Into You took a month. So it took one month.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We had so many different versions of pre-chorus. The chorus was somewhat usually there, but the verse and the pre to make it what it was and all those things like the songwriting. It wasn't every day for a month, but it was about a month in between when we started and when we finished the song.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And again, it's like, I always try and preach this to artists and producers that now like it's this new generation of artists come and they're like, I want a song like Into You. It's like, yeah, but you have to then be willing to put the work in on an Into You. Because it was a lot of work that went on in Into You. It wasn't not just the production, but the songwriting of Into You.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
There was tweaking of melodies, living with something for a week or a day. I mean, I have all the voice notes of so many different iterations of what the verse melody is. And it was a very crafted song. And a lot of work went into it. It wasn't like a three-hour song. It was like... It was a lot of challenging every melody and every inch of the track.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I know they did that with the track, every sound they experimented with. So there you go.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So God is a Woman, I think Ari's told this story as well. I had this chorus. I have the voice note here if you want to hear it. I actually have it in my phone.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
That'd be amazing. It is right here because I saved it for you.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So I was alone in the room and it was one of those moments. I don't mean to sound pretentious, but I just don't believe that anything is ours. You know, when it comes to creativity, I think it's all floating here. And I think some, I don't know why some people are given they're in the right mind space or open to grab one of those things.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it was one of those moments where I was sort of alone in the studio room. I think everyone was eating lunch. And I had the title God is a Woman in my phone. And I wanted a song called God is a Woman to be written. I just thought that was a great concept. And I have two boys, and I thought that how amazing it would be if my children got to hear it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I have two boys, and they get to hear a song called God is a Woman on the radio. That would be amazing. And all of a sudden, this came to me. And later on in the voice note you hear Rickard Goranson, who's an amazing guitar player, came into the room and I just put my hand out because he saw that I was doing something.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Back then, downtown was for like the university students and stuff like that. And but I knew of South by Southwest. And, you know, I was doing everything I could to get songs out there and heard. And, you know, whether it's calling 96.7 KHFI in Austin and like singing and doing like asking the DJ if I could sing and we would do like sing offs between, you know, me and someone else.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But what he did, which changed everyone, everything, was he grabbed the guitar and tried to find chords to what I was singing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it was so funny, right after the voiceover stopped, you hear Ilya run into the room, go, what was that? And it was one of those things where, We had that chorus. We tried another song. It didn't feel right. It just didn't feel right.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And you, again, when you, and this is, you know, during that time when I really realized like, oh, my trick is that like, oh, you got the, if you have that magic chorus, that's sacred. And if, if it, if it doesn't, whatever you write before that doesn't make a chorus feel great and you really love that chorus, then it's not right. Then you got to find the right thing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And we couldn't find the right thing for that chorus. Ilya flipped the track on it and did this beat. And then I was thinking, okay, we're going to have, because there was a number of people that wanted to try it. And then I thought, let's just do it with a rapper. We'll find a rapper.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I remember at the end of the sweetener sessions that we had done, I think we had done breathing and we had done no tears. I think we had every time by then is what I think. Ari was leaving to go home. I think she was finishing breathing vocals or something. She might remember this better because she's younger. And I didn't want, Ilya was like, we should play her God as a woman.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was nervous too, because other people had tried it. I didn't want her to feel like she's getting like a recycled idea. I mean, it wasn't, but, and he goes to her and I was like, no, no, I just wanted to be sensitive to her. And then he just, right when she's walking out the door, she's like, hey, Savin has this chorus called God as a woman. You want to hear it?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And she just goes, what, what now? It's called what? That's my song. You know, she knew and she cracked it. She cracked the, yeah, she was like, give me a chance with it. And I'm like, yeah, like, let's go do it. Amazing. And it was, you know, it was amazing. I'm so grateful for her to one and Ilya to actually say it because I wouldn't have said it. And otherwise it wouldn't have existed.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And she cracked it. I remember I was in San Diego getting my son's Swedish passport at the consulate and we were supposed to meet that day. But she got there early and she sent me a text going, I think I've cracked the pre-chorus. And she sent me the lyric to the pre-chorus and then sent me a voice note.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, oh, my God, I was trying to get back as soon as possible so we could finish and record it. But it was, yeah, I loved it. I really loved that song. And I have such special memories of that song.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Similar story with different person. Max actually brought in the start of that chorus melody. He had like, and then we loved it just at the ending. And yeah, we just felt that was super special. And then she came in and we wrote it with her. And yeah, and it was, that was, you know, that was a four day pre-chorus. We couldn't figure out the pre-chorus for that. same thing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
or like you know i would go south by southwest and i would um i would go to like i think it was a double tree hotel if i remember correctly this is again when it was a small indie festival and all the label people had um name tags and their walk that was where they stayed i kind of i did my research and figured out where a lot of people stayed and i'd go there with a box of demo tapes and i would pass out demo tapes to anyone with a badge i'd be like are you a record label or you're you know
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I mean, I get in pre-chorus hell sometimes, but that same thing, it was like four days. And finally the most obvious solution was following the pad. Yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But even though you have a gift, like her, you have a tool, like her voice, she's, you know, next level, next level. I mean, even by the way, as a songwriter, as people are witnessing now with the new album, she's, she's once in a generation talent.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So that's where social media goes wrong. That wasn't my song. I was on my sabbatical doing that song. So I wasn't even in LA or working. That was her and Max. They were working on a TV show. Or he was working on a TV show and asked her to come help him write some songs.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I don't know the details of the show. Um, yeah, there was there, I was helping write one that leaked, um, called gloss that was helping them tweak some lyric stuff with it. But, um, but yeah, I was in, I was in my, uh, sabbatical of two and a half years in Sweden being full-time dad.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, I mean, I had worked myself into a pretty dark depression towards the end of 2018. I found myself in a very, very dark place. I had an exit plan and everything. I was like, it just snuck up. And I went through 2019 knowing I had this plan in place, barely getting through every day. It just became, yeah, it was just, you know, somewhere along the way.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I'm open to talk about it because I feel like it's like another person. I think people that have gone through that, if they feel comfortable, should talk about it. Because a lot of people, I think, go through it. Yeah, somewhere along the way with, you know, my backstory of...
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
you know, how I was raised and everything, self-worth and achievement got wrapped up together and nothing made me feel good. No hit made me feel good. Anything that didn't succeed made me feel worse about myself. And then I felt worse about myself because there were things going well. And what kind of person would feel so horrible about life when
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He has a beautiful wife and two kids and his career. That's, you know, um, and I remember when, you know, like the Charlie's Angels song, when that didn't really work, I felt like a fit. I didn't understand why my kids wanted to hug me. You know, it was, that's how messed up my sort of thinking was this sort of intertwinement of self-worth and achievement.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And, um, without going into too much detail, sort of, and it's, Early 2020, a friend who I won't name just for her own sake caught me in the sense of there's something off here and pushed me to get into therapy and save my life, to be honest with you. Wow. So I took some time. I took time off. We moved back to Sweden. Then we had, you know, when I started feeling bad, I thought I was done.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was like retired. I was like, this is, I told Max, told everyone like I'm out because I don't see a way through this. And we moved back to Sweden. Mostly it's sort of like take the alcoholic out of the bar, you know, like being in LA and being around everything was, you know, let me just get away from it all.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and then when I started feeling better, we had a family illness, we had cancer hit my household and had to go through, through that. Um, and that was around, that was during COVID as well. So we, we, so yeah, it took, it took a while to get back to it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and people would take my tapes and then eventually I'd get kicked out for soliciting. So I'd go back down to the car, change my shirt, I'd put a hat on and go back up again. And I was doing those kinds of things. Every dime I could save was blank cassettes and stamps and envelopes. Like my parents had no idea what I was doing. My grades started like looking horrible.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Absolutely. Um, You know, I think it's so interesting because I talk about this for people all the time, like high achieving sort of individuals that you the people what it takes to get there is a hole in you that you're trying to fill that you'll never fill. That's why they keep going. Right.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I just happened to have the unfortunate where my DNA got me into a dark place of potential self-harm, you know.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and um but for very high achieving there is a hole that you're trying to fill it's this vicious cycle you know because almost you know and i i do think about do you need that hole to be as successful and i almost feel like you kind of do to a point you know but hopefully but a lot of people maybe don't go to the dark place they're just always trying to chase this carrot um
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Because if you, if music is what, if, you know, being a songwriter is what you choose to fulfill that whole, and you need that success, it's never going to be fulfilled, right? Because you have a hit and then you don't have a hit a few weeks later, it's no longer a hit. And then you, it is this never ending thing. And, and gosh, I was so lucky.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I look back at that time, my God, like I was so lucky to, to be in the rooms I was in, to be surrounded by the talent I was, you know, around and the gifts that the universe were dropping into my head, like, you know, the God is a woman, the what makes you beautiful. And I definitely have a different approach now in how I, do things and what I choose to do.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, and one of the things was I've decided to sort of dedicate a lot of my time into helping other Indian creatives in music sort of get a break and give them a shot. So I was in the middle of structuring that and going to Mumbai a lot and just, you know, doing a whole thing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
thing to make sure i'm not the only indian guy in the room um and you know and i'll do a couple projects here and there a year that i love and i'm focused a lot of my time in film and tv development and soundtracks that i love and things like that so in a sense the what drives you went from success to more of a purpose Yeah, exactly. Um, you know, luckily I have the luxury of doing that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I know not everybody does. Um, the sort of blessings of the success that I had allowed me to now like, yeah, I'm going to pick and choose what I feel like doing. And, um, I have a, I have a different purpose in life and it's, and it's all about, you
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
doing things that just inspire me not to get success, but just that's inspiring and things that I think my kids will enjoy or that will inspire other creatives that were like me when I was a teenager.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. And it's sad because social media is going to obviously amplify that so you guys have a tough time because you live in a world where that's everything. But yeah, I always give this advice to friends that if you feel self-worth and achievement is affecting your self-worth, that's when...
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So they were obviously freaked out, very traditional cliche Indian families. So that was like horrible for them. But I just, something inside me told me I had to do it. Like, you know, I was a huge baby face fan. That was my, that was my guy. Like,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
you gotta go into therapy to figure out why that is because eventually that'll get so entangled i think mine got so entangled that it it could have meant my kids didn't have a father you know um and before it gets too late i i always recommend that because it really the thing is it isn't
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, it's just it's so subjective and it's so random like the success nowadays, you know, especially on when it comes to something being viral. And, you know what I mean? If it could be something you do on purpose, everyone would do it, you know. So. Yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It was a great, great lesson to learn that like success and, or achievement and successes has nothing to do with the person, you know, I've met very successful people who were horrible people and you go, how does the universe giving these people, you know, um, but you know, you just have to also find what fulfills you and make you happy, makes you happy because you
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It's so cliche and it's so easy for someone with success or money or whatever to go like, oh, that stuff doesn't matter. And I and I do wish that people would know that before they get money and success and then they realize it. You know, like the reason why a lot of people with money success end up getting all spiritual at the end is because they realize that's not going to fulfill them.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And it really is true. It doesn't. It changes. It takes away certain stresses and problems. But then if you haven't fulfilled that thing, if you haven't, if you've got that hole that you're trying to fill, no money, no success, nothing is going to fill that hole unless you fix it yourself.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
um during that era and it was in the gossip column in austin american statesman once that babyface was vacationing with his family in lake travis i was like oh my god this is my chance to meet babyface so i like stayed up the whole night i wrote this letter and i did copies of my demo like tape to tape so you had it was like real time you had to like wait for the whole thing to copy and i looked the whole while my tape was making copies i was
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, absolutely. Sorry, I didn't, I like totally messed up the mood.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, it's definitely worth putting the work in to keep them separate.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. So we started talking, him and I. And I mean, first of all, again, generational talent. Definitely. I mean, visionary, this guy. I mean, he's a great guy as well. We started talking a lot, talking about how our process was and how he works. And, you know, it was this thing of like trying to
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
you know, figure out how the worlds could meet in a way that's authentic to him because he is the leader of that, of that. And we weren't always used to that. Like, you know, we're used to like pop stars and we'll give ideas, you know, and, um, But for the weekend, it was, you know, it's his vision. It's his thing, you know, for sure. From day one, it wasn't something he grew into.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Sometimes people grow into that. And then now and then after a few hits and albums, it's they are steering the ship. He's from the moment we met him, he was steering the ship. It's his vision. And. Yeah, it was me, Peter Svensson, Al Piyami at first.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And the first thing we did, it took a few days to crack something that felt good because it was either we were taking him too much in our world or it was going too much, way too much in where he is, his space he was. And it wasn't, it wasn't sort of resulting in what everyone had expected it to, which was to find this sort of happy medium.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And the first time we, the first song that felt like we got there close to it was in the night. And that got everyone excited. Okay, this is going to work together. And then after that, Can't Feel My Face showed up into our lives. And again, I credit that very much, the sonics of that is Ali Piyami and Abel. Abel sort of saying what he wants and Ali executing it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And we all, you know, the funny thing with Can't Find My Face was that we all thought In The Night was the song. Everyone thought In The Night was the song at the time. Wow. And... And it wasn't until some weeks before release that it was swapped. I guess I got a call from Charlie Walker, who was the promo guy at Republic at the time. He said, bro, I just spoke to Abel.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It's going to be in the night. I said, it's going to be Can't Feel My Face. I was like, really? Because at the time, that's what we just all thought in the night was the song. But it was amazing to... Again, I'm, like, such a pop guy. So I wasn't, like, hip to, like, the weekend and the culture he was building until we started working with him.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We saw one of his shows at the Hollywood Bowl and we're like, oh, shit. You know, this guy... is not only a visionary, but he's brave as fuck because he could have continued doing what he was doing. And, you know, and then I earned it popped. So we started having commercial hits. He did not need us, you know? Um,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But to be brave enough to go, okay, I'm going to try this new way of doing something and working when you already had this massive success, that's a pretty brave thing for an artist to do, I think. And I think all the great ones are brave like that.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I think all the great ones, there's this great David Bowie quote where he says, an artist should live in the place where you, when you're walking into the beach, like, you know, if you're on the... on the sand and you walk into the water and you keep walking and you keep walking and the water rises as rises and rises.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And then it gets to the point where the water is like right above your upper lip and you kind of have to lift your head up and it's sort of this uncomfortable feeling. Have you ever felt that? That's where an artist should live. And it's like such a great way of putting it because that's what Abel does. It seems all the time.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Looking up the yellow pages, again, it was pre-internet. So I like highlighted all the addresses of rental condos around Lake Travis. I convinced three friends to come with me. Six in the morning, we get in the car and we drive and we knock on every single door and all the addresses that I found. And for everyone that didn't answer the door, I left a demo tape on the doorstep.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Like he just pushes and he was a visionary and, and it was funny for me and the rest of the guys, cause we were never like the cool people. Like we did the pop stuff, not like the cool stuff. You know, we did the songs that the labels forced their artists to do. You know what I mean? They would work, but it would be the late, it wasn't like the stuff the artists wanted to do.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And for the first time, like artists were calling me up going, Hey,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
heard you're working with the weekend can i come listen to what you guys are doing you know it was like and i was like oh wow this is like all of a sudden we're like cool because we're we had songs the weekend and yeah i mean my my second son was born when we got the chart numbers for can't feel my face and it was number two it was like trying to get it went back to number it went to number one the following week
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But I remember being in the birthing suite going, this is how bad I was, by the way. Like I was in the birthing suite looking at chart numbers, you know, or waiting for the text coming, did we get number one? Rather than focusing on my kid. But it was, yeah, it was fun. I mean, I learned a lot by working with him. Learned to really just trust the artists sometimes, like,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, we were so used to before working with Ariana, like I was used to like sort of manufactured boy bands and all these kind of things. They were part of a machine, not to make it all like that, but it was like, you know, a lot of times it would be you write a song, the label convinces the artist to do it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But to have like a very it was the first time working with a very artist driven project, if you know what I mean. I mean, Ariana was like what became that as well. But like from day one, Weeknd was like, here's my vision, you know, you know, and it was it was amazing for us to like, oh, OK, we have to give up some control here, you know.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Sam Smith one was great. Sam, again, loveliest human, so talented. I remember I wasn't even sure if I was going to do that session because I felt like I didn't have any ideas. I had never, I hadn't really met him before. So I felt, I always sometimes felt like I have to come with an idea. And my wife knew I loved the show, This Is Us. And it was a Wednesday when I was working with Sam.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
She was like, well, just don't cancel. Just like, wasn't that show you like? Wasn't that on yesterday? Go watch that before you go to the studio. And I was watching, I don't want to spoil anyone who hasn't seen This Is Us, by the way, the greatest drama ever on network television. Shout out to Dan Vogelman, who created it. So I watched this episode of This Is Us.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And for those of you, have you watched This Is Us before? No, but my mom is a big fan of it. Okay, so your mom will know this episode. It's an episode where they find out that the dad had a brother. And Mandy Moore's character says something like,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
i don't understand how he slept knowing he was lying to me like she like with empathy she was like i feel so bad that he kept the secret not that she was mad at him more that that he he probably it must have been so hard how did he sleep knowing he lied to me and right away again one of those things for the universe i started singing on my into my phone
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, you just have to do all those things to to to make it. I mean, I didn't know any other way. So I just made shit up, you know, and eventually people started replying to my demos that I would send out and Barnes and Nobles like I found a book of music industry addresses and. And eventually people started replying. I would get letters of feedback from random music publishers.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I was like, oh, that feels like George Michael. That's a good chorus. So I would go in the studio with confidence. I think I have something. And then Sam, of course, being brilliant, switched it to, how do you sleep when you lie to me? And, you know, and saw it for what it was. And then Ilya did an amazing job with the track. And then there you go. I love that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. And luckily I got to, I was on a Zoom once with Dan Fogelman because he was helping, he was giving some advice on a show I was developing. Very, very lovely, kind guy. And I got to tell him the story, which was awesome. And he freaked out. Incredible.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
to tell my wife i was like what do you mean oh my god you're dan fogelman you created this with us um yeah and cool for the summer again it's just i love demi i have such a soft spot for demi i'd had a few like a hit with her before back in the shara lloyd days where shara jumped on the song really don't care yeah that song's great too oh thanks And I had a good relationship with Demi.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We did Confidence and that felt good. And which ended up being like the huge sync song, where I go confident. But, you know, she always loved the guitar thing. I always saw her as like a new Kelly Clarkson. She has such a fantastic warm tone and voice and everything. You know, I said, I want to do something with guitars. Ali had this track.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It felt like chaos, but it was genius in this chaos of this sort of sonic landscape. We had to cut and, you know, paste parts of it. And he's, you know, he's just so, he was so good at that stuff. He is. yeah, we just crafted this song. Like it took a long time to craft Cool for the Summer, by the way, because it's a very different structure. It was the same.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
One of those things where the song is most important that we had like bits of it. Tell me what you want, think you love it, okay. I've got that on my computer as well. The, the actually all the voice memos of writing cool for summer and the different versions and stuff.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. That time I did would use garage band as my dictaphone. So I've got a lot of stuff on old garage band. Cause then you could save track by track. So that's what I did. And there's, there's a bunch of cool for the summer stuff. And, Sat with Demi for a bit, cracking it.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Then Alexander Crinlin, same guy who seemed to be at that time my problem solver, you know, came in, why don't you sing that riff? You know, cool for the summer, wait for the mother, you know. And it's a very different structure. It was a hard song to crack. Because, you know, as you know, you have the pre and then you have an instrumental before the chorus comes in, right?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And that was like weird to everyone, but we managed to make it work. And it was a team, that was such a team effort, that song. Amazing. And she killed it. I mean, Demi's, again, what a talent. So underrated as a talent. Vocalist, as a writer. I mean, she's, I think she's incredible.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So funny enough, again, credit to that song is Ali Piyami and Ilya. Yeah. They actually had that pretty, I mean, they had that pretty much there. And I just filled in blanks, wrote lyrics, you know. Both of them, me and Max went to go see a screenings or like scenes of Fifty Shades of Grey. We're told this hype movie is going to come out and they wanted songs from us.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And so we went and we saw those scenes and the helicopter scene where the song happens.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and went back to the studio i think it was the same day or the next day the night before ali and ilia not even knowing about the 50 shades of gray thing started this idea and max called me up because he had heard it and he goes hey isn't this great for that scene and then i was like yeah shit so wrote wrote it for that scene um the light the thing of like uh the comma about your um
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Again, it would be like one in San Francisco, one in Omaha, things like that, that had nothing to do with the kind of music I was making. And, but I would, I, you know, it would be funny. Like I would like, you know, I'd get a letter reply with like positive feedback. Like, Oh, I dropped my spoon while I made my tea that morning. So I'd start dropping, I started dropping my spoon every morning.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Cause I've never been so high. Let me take you past the satellites and all that. Those lines were from watching the scene where they're, they're in the heck of helicopter. I don't know if you've seen the movie. I haven't, but I just seen the scene and they're like in a helicopter going above the city. Um, it was great.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It started this wonderful relationship that I really cherish with Ellie Goulding. Um, who has, like, I mean, come on, her voice is just insane, her tone. Yeah, very unique. And we're really grateful she agreed to do the song because she's a songwriter. She normally wouldn't do, like, an outside song. And other than Burn, I think, was the only other one.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And she did Love Me Like You Do and was so gracious. And, yeah, and it's become this classic love song, which is... which is wild, you know, and playing it at weddings. Yeah. Um, but I really got to give Ilya and Ali a lot of that credit. Um, it's a fantastic melody that they came up with. Um, and, um, yeah, we got our golden globe nomination for that.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So that like opened up this whole world of like, Ooh, this is fun.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, that really gave me the bug. I mean, I saw music for movies as a way for me to get into movies. For sure. You know, I started then meeting directors and blah, blah, blah. And I'd be like, oh, I've got this idea for film. And then I started selling some movies, you know. But I've been using music as my way to sort of to get in. It's worked. Yeah. It's worked so far, thankfully.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It was, you know, Eurovision happened after that. Yeah. Troy's Angels and Eurovision sort of happened around the same time. And Eurovision, again, sort of do my depression days, but it was like this light. I enjoyed it so much. It was just so fun and fun to work with Will Ferrell and the director, David, was like, he did... wedding crashers, which it's like unbelievable. I love that movie.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So it was super exciting. It was just a fun, exciting time. So like, uh, that, that was sort of my solace during my sort of depression was that movie and being a part of that process. Um, and you know, and yeah, we got and gave an Oscar nomination to us. So that was like incredible, incredible experience. Sometimes I forget that it happens, you know, to be like, Oh yeah. An Oscar nomination.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
That's kind of fun.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Unbelievable. An unbelievable person.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
He was amazing. Just the greatest guy. Um, I got to spend a fair amount of time with him. His wife is Swedish as well. So we kind of bonded over that. Um, Yeah. Just the greatest guy and, um, and still in touch to this day. And like, um, yeah, like I can't say there's something going on with Eurovision that I can't say that's going to be exciting, um, that we're still working on.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Everything was about like wanting the universe to give me some feedback. Um, I ended up having to remember like so many things to do throughout the day. It was, it became just like OCD thing that I had. And, um, Um, eventually like people started replying and it was like, you know, Hey kid, I like what you're doing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, but yeah, it opened up a whole world for me. You know, when you get that Oscar nominee attached to your name, all of a sudden films that I was developing, all these deals that were in limbo all of a
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
like now it's like oh okay and it opens up a whole world of i really really enjoy like doing that like soundtracks and stuff like that um so it opened up a whole world of other opportunities and during my like sabbatical you know sorry i'm bumping like during my sabbatical like i when i felt like i needed to be creative i was selling films and tv shows and then um when i wanted some music i'd
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, we did do the Paw Patrol song for the Paw Patrol movie or Ron's Gone Wrong and doing things that I think my kids would like. And then I got a call to do this great movie I'm super excited about called The Idea View, where we're launching this band, this boy band, August Moon. You can follow on TikTok at August Moon.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And their first song just launched a few days ago, which we're super excited about.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Thank you so much. Dance Before We Walk. Dance Before We Walk, yeah. It's a great song. Yeah, thank you. They're great. I mean, it's a fun project to sort of create a band in a film and blend it with the real world. And seeing the reaction has been so fun. And the film's closing South by Southwest. It'll be out May 2nd.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So it's going to be fun to go to South by Southwest with the film closing South by Southwest after this. how I started when I was a teenager sneaking into Southwest, you know, so it's kind of a fun circle. Yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It goes back to the old days of me doing stuff. You know what I mean? Like once I started working with like the Ariana's and the Ellie's and then you're writing, you're writing with an artist, an artist has a vision or you're collaborating on a vision.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, but the artist has a, such an important and strong sort of point of view that you're, you're basically in the service industry to that artist and their vision, right. And their point of view. Um, before those days you would be writing for like, you know, Simon Cowell's bands like Westlife or Shane Ward or some of these UK acts and you're writing basically for the record labels taste.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Keep sending me music or, you know, and then at one point I got this, um, letter from a guy in Nashville and he goes, Hey kid, I really like your tape. I can make you a star. If you pay me $3,000, I'll make proper studio recordings for the demo and you could perform at a showcase at the wild horse saloon in Nashville and I'll publish your songs. Wow. I was like, oh my gosh.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Does that make sense? Um, and so it's not like a particular artist point of view. It's you're writing just great. You're trying to write great pop songs. Yeah. Um, and, and you get to be the artist a little bit, right? Like what makes you beautiful? I got to be the artist a little bit.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
It was my song that was, you know, and this just let me go back to those days, which I do, I do miss a little bit of being like, just writing what I want, what I would love to say and what I, and things that I think are fun. Um,
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, not that I don't think the music I was making was fun, but just, just go back to the, again, why I got into pop, why I love pop music, which is boy bands and creating a phenomenon like, um, and I love that. I love just free, not trying to be cool, just great pop songs, you know?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
daring to not be cool and not thinking about the radio you know there's a box that you get that your songs have to be put in when you're structuring for radio and all these things and there's no box to be put in for that you know and that's really creative in a different way which I love like Eurovision I would have never you know it was so fun to write like Lion of Love and Cooling with the Homies because we're not trying to be cool we're not trying to fit in this radio box you know
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, so it's, so with this movie, it's been a little bit of, it felt like I was going back to the old days.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Well, we tried so many different songs for that. There was a song called Looking in the Mirror that Demi sings, going back to the awesome Demi Lovato. That for a moment was going to be the final song. Dave Dobkins, the director and I kept going back and forth on the final song. It took
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
i think there was like 11 different versions of husavik before we settled on that version so yeah it was maybe potentially going to be in a different spot in the movie and then as the song developed and and we all we me and david started agreeing and then will as well started going you know what this is probably the song
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, Molly Sundin is one of the Swedish biggest pop stars. And she was so gracious to be the voice of Sigrid. And Rachel McAdams sang a little bit as well. And Rachel's a better singer than she thinks she is. But yeah, it's all those big notes and stuff. It's Molly Sundin. She killed it.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and and it's yeah it was it was a great thing to be a great fun thing to be a part of and just seeing how like hearing you say that your family watches that movie it's a different thing than when someone is like oh I love that song it's like being a part of a film like that that becomes like a cult classic kind of thing because in Europe where I'm in Sweden like so many people like they think that's what I do and
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And that's where they recognize me from is my name and the credits of of Eurovision, you know. But it's so fun to be a part of stuff like that.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, because I think it deals with a lot of interesting topics. The age gap between the two characters and Anne's character and Nick's character. I think it's the way they handle it. The director, Michael Showalker, the way he's handled it is so great. You really see the consequences of, because in a way it's a bit of a nodding hill, like in that sense that you see the consequences of situations.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You also get to know a pop star and, you know, Luckily, they were great with taking ideas and asked advice about what would that person type would be going through. And you get to see a different side of that whole thing, the imposter syndrome and those kind of feelings that...
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I had no idea what that meant, by the way, but I was like, oh my gosh, he's gonna publish my song. That just sounded cool. So I went to school the next day and guess what? Guess what? This guy's gonna publish my songs. And I started like saving up money. And I kind of told my parents about it because I needed like them to know I'm going to go to Nashville.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
i've been around in my past with a number of different groups and that got famous and you see that's always not what it seems you know um and yeah it's just a really beautiful story um i'm really proud of the music there's a song at the end of it called the idea of you that i'm really proud of um
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And yeah, it's, and if you love, if you love like boy band, like fun, like lighthearted, um, boy band pop songs, like you're really like this movie as well. You love the soundtrack. It's, it's really good. I think we did a really good job of getting it right. If I have to toot my own horn.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. It's cool. So yeah.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Oh gosh. Um, It's so hard because I don't really, I'm always super critical with my songs. I mean, there's ones that I'm really proud of. Also just seeing what it meant to my life and how it changed my life. Thankfully, for the audience who listened to it and the artists to record it, like, you know, What Makes You Beautiful was a big life shift for me. And, um, and I'm really proud of that.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I'm really, I'm really proud that like, um, my children get to have, you know, my 11 year old and eight year old. And that song is such a big part of their world. Not because of me, the fact that it's like still out there and it still matters. Like they hear it at school, like their teachers play it at school during PE. It's like become one of this.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Like, so if I, if they had no idea that I wrote this song, they would, it would be one of the songs they hear sort of more commonly in their life.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and they know it's about their mom so i i just love that they get to go walk through life knowing that this song is about their mom um so i'm really proud of that you know the way that santa tell me is connected to everyone i'm a big christmas guy yeah um i'm so so so proud of that and the life that it's had i actually have a theory about christmas music
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And they had to come, like someone had to drive me and take the long trip. And they were like horrified by this whole thing. But I think they were just humoring me. And they were like, yeah, you earn the money yourself. You do what you want with your money. And a few weeks later, I'm getting ready for school. And the phone rings and I pick it up. And this guy goes, hello, is Savin Kataka there?
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
What, that Hindus write the best Christmas songs? I mean, we're one for one.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Listen, thank you. I'm so proud of that song and what it's done. You know, so I think, you know, really proud of One Last Time and, you know, God is a Woman and... you know, it's also some, to me, some of them are like, it's also about the time, like what it meant to me and how I grew as a writer from those songs, if that makes sense. Um, so yeah.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And there's, since I've been back to work, you know, there's a, there's a couple of things coming out, hopefully at the end of the year that I'm really excited about and proud of, um, that I can't talk about, but I I'm really proud of those things.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Well, one advice I'd say, and this is going to sound pessimistic, but I just mean it because it weeds out whether you are really meant to do it or not, is that you have to be willing. You have to go in knowing that you're going to starve for it. You know, you have to be willing to sacrifice and starve for it because it's not easy.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But you have to love making music enough that it doesn't matter if you make a living making it. You just want to make it. And those are the people that end up being the big ones. Yeah. Um, and second is, is cliche, but it's, it's perseverance. Um, if you really believe in it and believe in something, you gotta push it through.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Um, you can tell me one of my big, my big, my songs, and I'll tell you like an artist or label person or someone who didn't believe in it. You know what I mean? Um, and then melody, melody, melody, melody is a universal language. Um,
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
and um don't forget that melody there'll be there'll be cycles in america where lyrics will matter more but globally traditionally melody melody melodies that's the universal language and um and yeah and you know listen it's tough nowadays right with streaming and and i sometimes fear that music is becoming like photography you know when it becomes easy for everyone to do it
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You know, there's very few things that cut through. There's very few iconic new photographs, right? But I believe that if the bar is set when you're creating, that the world doesn't need just another good song. The world needs something that they need. You know, it has to be something game changing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was like, yeah, this is Savin. He goes, hi, I'm not going to say the guy's name because I don't want to call him out. But he's a great guy. We're still in touch. This guy from Jive Records calls me. He goes, I don't know how your shitty demo got on my desk. Because I think my secretary put it there. But there's actually a song on here I really like.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So I encourage new writers and producers to be creative and to push boundaries and to think of that. Think of like, does the world need this song? Or is this just like, eh, it's a good song. There's 140,000 songs released on Spotify every day. That's crazy.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And when you're writing, like you're competing against every other song ever written because we all have access to it on the same technology, right? So old songs don't feel old to kids now because it's on the same technology. Like my kids came from school the other few months back and they're like, oh my God, Papa, have you heard this new song called Mama Said Knock You Out? You know what I mean?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
But to them, because it's on the same technology, it's not like when i was a kid it's like oh records those that's old you know i'm on cds that's interesting so i would just encourage music matters like music matters like great music matters it's still powerful can i tell a story yeah we can end on this my story if i if you want
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
When I was in Sweden during like the early days, this is like 2008-ish, sort of towards the end of the Bush or early Obama administration, you know, Sweden took in the most, more Iraqis than America did after America bombed Iraq. Wow. And I was, all the cab drivers were a lot of Iraqis, you know. And I was in this cab and this guy goes, oh, where are you from?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I said, I'm from, forgive my accent, I'm from America. He said, where are you from? He's like, I'm from Iraq. I was like, oh. He says, yes, I, you know, I moved here with my son, my young son, my nephew. I lived in a village with my wife and two boys. America bombed my village.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
We had no terrorists in our village, but America bombed the village, and I lost my oldest son and my wife, and Sweden took us in. I was like, oh my God, I'm so sorry. And he was like, I was a doctor in Iraq, but now I drive cabs. But he was like a jolly guy. I was like, I'm so sorry, man.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So how does like someone like you or your son, how do you grow up not hating America and like and having like bitterness towards someone like me? Because I was from Texas, you know. And he goes, music. And I go, what do you mean? And he goes, it's hard to hate people that make something you love. And that really sticks with me, right? Is that music still matters.
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
So it's still a privilege to make music and to create music. So keep that in mind, you know, when creating it, that you want to make something that really matters.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Oh, thank you so much, man. It was a pleasure to meet you. Congrats on everything.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I had no, again, no idea that this was a big deal. And he was like, well, listen, I just signed this band out of Florida called Backstreet Boys. And I'd love them to try out the song. And I was like, well, it goes as long as it's not published.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Absolutely. Thank you so much, man.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah, this is when he just signed them. So back in the day, it was a company named Zamba on Jive Records. And you couldn't get a cut with a Jive Records artist unless Zamba published the song. So he goes, if the song's not published, I'd love to try it with the band. I was like, well, and he's like, how old are you? I was like, I'm 17. He's like, you write it yourself?
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I was like, yeah, I wrote it myself. He's like, okay, is it published? I was like, no, but I'm saving money because this guy in Nashville is saying that. And I was like, and I really want a record deal for my vocal harmony group. And he was like, you know, trying to talk me out. He's like, you're never supposed to pay, you know, money to get your song published. I've never heard of this guy.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Let me ask my Nashville folks, because if we don't know this guy, he trusts me. He's not legit. I'm with Jive Records. We're like a legit label. I was like, I didn't know what Jive Records was. So I didn't, you know, there was no internet at the time to look shit up. So. I was sort of suspect of this guy. Cause he was kind of like abrasive.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And after, you know, then he kept talking to me and he was like, listen, kid, you're not the greatest singer. If that's you singing on the tape. And he was like, that's not the only problem. He was like, I could tell by your name, you're different ethnicity. I was like, yeah. He was like, you know, look, I'm a black American. So I'm saying this with utmost respect. I just want to be real with you.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And he was like, you mind telling me what ethnicity you are? I said, I'm Indian. He goes, well, listen, kid, no girl in Wisconsin is going to put an Indian guy on her wall. You should just be a songwriter. And I was like, oh. And it sort of stuck with me. I ended up doing the $3,000 thing, getting ripped off. But I realized during that time, like, oh, I should just be a songwriter.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And yeah, weirdly, when I did that showcase, even though I got ripped off, and the Jive Records guy stayed in touch with me, you know, he, during the Millennium album, actually called me again and said, look, if you can get that song back, I'd love to try it with them. I have this other song called I Need You Tonight, and I can replace it with your song if you can get it back.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Five kids walk in and I was like, they have something. And it was One Direction.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
And I couldn't get it back because the guy ripped me off and disappeared, right? But during that showcase that I did, a manager saw me and said, actually, you're really talented. I like your songs. I'm going to send it to, you know, if you're ever in New York, I'm going to introduce you to this lawyer in New York. And I luckily, like a year later, had this cousin that
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Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
got transferred to New York from the UK, and I asked my parents, can I go visit my cousin? And my ulterior motive was to go to New York and meet this lawyer. And they said yes, and I went and visited my cousin. And I stayed at his place, but I went and I met this lawyer who hooked me up with a lot of publishers. My last meeting, everyone rejected me.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Everyone was like, no, your songs aren't good enough, or your demos aren't more professional enough. And this one guy, Clyde Lieberman, at the old BMG Publishing, was like, I hear something in this. Let me send it to a new guy we hired in LA, a guy named Benjamin Groff. And he goes, let me see what he thinks. And then eventually they signed me.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Yeah. So that was the short version, short and long version of the story.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
No, they were horrified. I mean, now that I'm older and I have kids of my own, I get it. You know, they were immigrants. They were from Uganda. They were kicked out of Uganda. They came to this country and they worked hard to make a life for us. And then it was like, and, you know, we're raised around an Indian community, all immigrants. Right. And music was just nothing.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
They don't they had no reference for it. You know, and I was the only one my whole career. I was like the only Indian guy in the Western music business. So my dad was kind enough because my grades were so bad. I was skipping class and sneaking into the choir room every year throughout high school. And he was like, look, you're going to have two years. We're going to allow you to live in our house.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
I woke up to a text from Harry going, I think you really nailed it with this one.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
You have to go to community college. If in two years you can't figure your stuff out, you're going to university. Otherwise, I'm kicking you out. So I luckily got a publishing deal within those two years. But it was, it was like my, you know, my, it was a weird thing for them to accept.
Behind The Wall
Savan Kotecha: The Songwriting Genius Behind the Hits That Defined a Generation
Even still, my mom was a bit, even though I, you know, everything I've done and bought her a home and all that kind of stuff, it's still such a strange thing for them to accept. It wasn't really until I did X Factor because all my relatives live in the UK. When I did X Factor, I was on television. So everyone was like, oh my God, Simon's on TV.