Shirley Turner
Appearances
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The summer of 2000 was a very important time for Andrew. It was a time for him to begin his residency in medicine. Now, Andrew wasn't sure what direction he wanted to go in, but he ultimately decided to pursue a career in surgery. So that summer, he ended up taking a surgical residency in the United States in Syracuse, New York. It was a really exciting time for him.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
It was the start of his prosperous career, and his girlfriend, Shirley Turner, was also given a great opportunity. By that point, she had already finished her residency and she had just been offered a position at a family practice in Sac City, Iowa.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
however the only issue was that sac city and syracuse are about 16 hours away from one another by car so she and andrew would have to try long distance but together they decided that it would be worth it so that summer they both packed up their bags and started their new lives in different states here in america now long distance can really put a relationship to the test but surprisingly andrew and shirley's relationship was handling it well
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Eventually, by 2001, Andrew was so miserable in his surgical residency, he decided to switch to family practice, where he was a much better fit. But this career change also meant he had to move. He ended up taking a residency in Latrobe, Pennsylvania, and almost immediately, Andrew's friends and family could tell a huge difference in him. Andrew was happy there.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
He quickly found a core group of friends who he loved, and he even made a huge impression on his community. In fact, after just a few weeks working at the family practice, people were coming in and asking for him by name. Finally, he had found exactly where he belonged. But with this new chapter of life, he soon began to realize that Shirley Turner was not the one for him.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Sure, when he was miserable in New York, he liked having her around because he didn't have anyone else. But now that he had found his calling and a new community, the thought of being with her just wasn't appealing anymore. So, slowly, he started distancing himself from her, but surely wasn't having it. She continued to visit him in Latrobe and grew irate when she wasn't involved in his plans.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But soon after, more red flags arose. You see, throughout this trip to California, David and Kate had been happily taking care of bills for the group. But on the last night of the trip, Shirley offered to pay for everyone's dinner at a fondue restaurant. Kate mentioned that it was expensive, insisting that Shirley didn't have to pay, but Shirley stated it wasn't a problem.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And then she started making jokes about new fees.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
now though the term doesn't have the same magnitude it did then with the general population many people still consider that word to be a slur during the mid to late 20th century new feet was used by american and canadian forces stationed in newfoundland to demean the locals they used it to describe someone who was lazy poor and uneducated and this usage continued for many decades
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Some friends who were with Shirley were offended by her use of the phrase and told her that they didn't think her jokes were funny, and in response, Shirley ran to the bathroom crying. Now, Kate didn't want to see Shirley upset, so she went into the bathroom to check on her, and when she did, she found Shirley sobbing on the shoulder of a complete stranger.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
When Shirley looked up from her sobs, she started screaming at Kate that her friends were using them as a cheap hotel. The whole situation was bizarre, and soon after, When Shirley finally calmed down enough to return to the table, the bill came and she commented, Oh, I suppose you expect the rich doctor to pay for this.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
From here, Kate and David put their share on the table and the group left for what I can only imagine was an incredibly awkward car ride home. The Bagby's were finally getting an understanding as to why their son didn't seem happy in his relationship, but they never could have imagined what would happen next. Hey everybody, Courtney and I have a favor to ask of you.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
If you love Murder in America, you love our show, please leave us a five-star review wherever you listen to your podcasts, whether that's Apple Podcasts, Spotify. If you love our show and you want to help us grow, definitely consider leaving us a five-star review. Also, it helps the show so much when people share out links to our program.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
So if you're listening and you're loving what we're doing here, Share us on your Instagram story. Shout us out on X. Post one of our shows on your Facebook. And let the world, your friends, your family know that you're listening to Murder in America. It seriously helps us so much. It helps us grow the show. We couldn't do this without all of you listening at home. Seriously, thank y'all.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The previous night, Andrew's mother Kate had tried to reach him. They spoke several times a week, and Kate enjoyed telling Andrew just how proud of him she was. On November 6th, Kate had no idea that her son had passed. Looking back on that morning, it's heartbreaking to think about those few hours of naivety before her entire world turned upside down.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Kate was expecting to hear from Andrew sooner or later, but when her phone rang that morning, she was surprised to see that it was a call from Shirley Turner. Upon answering, Shirley asked Kate if she had spoken to Andrew recently, because she hadn't heard from him and she was concerned. But Kate brushed it off, saying Andrew was probably just busy and he would likely get in touch soon.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Then after that, she hung up the phone. However, Kate couldn't help but think about how strange it was that Shirley would call her from work. Then, about 30 minutes later, she saw that Shirley was calling again, and this time she was frantic. Shirley told Kate that the police had contacted her boss in Iowa in regard to Andrew, but they didn't give her any details on what was going on.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And it's at this moment when Kate began to panic. The police don't call someone's loved ones unless something horrible happened. Kate begged Shirley to call Andrew's hospital to ask what was going on, but Shirley refused, saying that she had a history with the switchboard operator.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
David threw the phone, began to scream, and repeatedly punched and kicked a filing cabinet in his private office. He then picked up the phone and told Kate that he would drive to her office to get her. Having had a few more minutes than him to process the news, Kate was able to think a little more clearly.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She told David that there was no way he should be driving, and that they should both get rides from someone back to their house. So from there, David walked to his boss's office, trying to maintain his composure. When the door closed behind him, he collapsed into sobs, telling his boss, Andrew is dead. Can you take me home? And of course, he did.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Warning, the following podcast is not suitable for all audiences. We go into great detail with every case that we cover and do our best to bring viewers even deeper into the stories by utilizing disturbing audio and sound effects.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
went over to him and when we could see his face, I said, it's really him. I kissed him and held him and Kate kissed him and held him and kissed him some more. Tears were dropping on him of course and Kate went to wipe one of those away off his cheek. A plug came out where he'd been shot in the left cheek.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
What bothers Kate is that she did not go with him to the crematorium and stay with him right to the end.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In the documentary, David said, But David and Kate didn't know where to direct their hatred. All they knew was that someone had murdered their son. However, the police investigating Andrew's murder had a pretty good idea on who their suspect was. And that was none other than Shirley Turner.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The story we're about to tell you is one of tragedy and heartbreak, but it's also a love story at heart. And that love story began unexpectedly on the sunny shores of Long Beach, California. Kate Barnard was born in England, but in 1967, she moved to California to work as a travel nurse. Upon moving to the States, her main goal was to build her career.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
After interviewing coworkers at the hospital, they learned that Andrew had been having problems with Shirley. They also said that Andrew was actually supposed to be meeting with Shirley the very day he was shot and killed. So, as you can imagine, the investigators immediately want to speak with her. But when they got Shirley on the phone, her behavior was shocking, to say the least.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And something was very wrong, because that next morning, Andrew Bagby was found shot to death at the Keystone State Park. In the weeks after Andrew's death, investigators were learning all this information, and it became very clear that Shirley Turner was responsible for his death. And throughout that time, Andrew's parents, David and Kate,
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
stayed in Pennsylvania to assist in whatever way they could. They had uprooted their entire lives, because at that point, nothing else mattered. Through their grief, Andrew's coworkers really stepped up to the plate to help them out. Many brought them food and ran errands for them, just to alleviate their pain.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
David stated in his book, "...they knew us in the bottom of our pit, and we have known them at the peak of their generosity."
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Yeah. Do you remember when they started dating?
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Once the temperatures started rising this spring, Courtney and I both realized that we were back in the same worn-out rotation. We were wearing the same tanks, the same shorts, the same pants, the same everything. So, we both decided to switch things up, and we gave our daily uniforms an upgrade with quints.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Their pieces are easy, elevated, and somehow make us feel more put together without even trying. Honestly, we've talked about this company before, but Quince makes incredibly comfortable, very well-fitted clothing that Courtney and I have come to love.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Even with the simple things like t-shirts, I love wearing my t-shirts that I've gotten from Quince every day, whether I'm sitting at home editing videos and podcasts or Courtney and I are running around town getting some things done. Through Quince, you can get 100% European linen shorts and dresses from $30, luxe swimwear, Italian leather platform sandals, and so much more. But the best part?
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Everything with Quince is priced 50-80% less than what you'd find at similar brands. By working directly with top artisans and cutting out the middlemen, Quince gives you luxury without the markup. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes. So treat your closet to a little summer glow up with Quince.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Go to quince.com slash America for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash America to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash America. And now let's get back to our story.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She planned to travel the world working as an OBGYN nurse before settling back in the countryside of Devon to live out the rest of her life. As she started her journey in California, she had no intentions of getting married, or even finding love for that matter. But life has a funny way of surprising you.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In late 1967, she and a fellow nurse decided to join two local navy men on a date to Disneyland. She and her friend were mostly excited about not having to pay for their own tickets, but Kate had no idea that the man she was about to meet on this date to Disney would change her life forever.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And something was very wrong, because that next morning, Andrew Bagby was found shot to death at the Keystone State Park. In the weeks after Andrew's death, investigators were learning all this information, and it became very clear that Shirley Turner was responsible for his death.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And throughout that time, Andrew's parents, David and Kate, stayed in Pennsylvania to assist in whatever way they could. They had uprooted their entire lives because at that point, nothing else mattered. Through their grief, Andrew's coworkers really stepped up to the plate to help them out. Many brought them food and ran errands for them just to alleviate their pain.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
David stated in his book, They knew us in the bottom of our pit, and we have known them at the peak of their generosity.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
If you love Murder in America, you love mysteries, you love true crime, you love murder stories and the unknown, then I have a new show for you. It's called The Conspiracy Files, and it's hosted by me, Colin Brown, from Murder in America and The Paranormal Files.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
On The Conspiracy Files, we explore everything from bizarre deaths to freak paranormal events, pedophile rings, government corruption, ritual sacrifice. No topic is untouched on this show. Everything that we talk about on The Conspiracy Files is backed up with fact.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I release reference sheets with every single episode that we do so you guys know everything we're talking about is confirmed to have happened and be real. It's a completely different type of show. than anything else you've ever seen about conspiracy theories.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Instead of a bunch of conjecture and theories, we're presenting you people with facts, telling you the story, walking you through the story just as detailed as we do with Murder in America, and then letting the listener decide what they think. Anyways, you should definitely give it a listen. It's called The Conspiracy Files.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The links are in the description of this show, and you can find it on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And now let's get back to our story.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Shirley Turner was born on January 28, 1961. Her parents met in St. Anthony, Newfoundland, where her American father was stationed. He married Shirley's mother, a Canadian, and the two moved to Wichita, Kansas, where Shirley was born. When Shirley was seven, her parents divorced.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
she moved back with her mother to newfoundland then from there her life was that of an involuntary nomad her mother struggled to support shirley and her siblings on a single income which resulted in them moving frequently to find affordable housing shirley reportedly spoke often about the poverty she experienced as a child telling others that that played a part in her decision to enter medicine
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
on december 28 1981 when shirley was 20 she married her first husband in parsons pond a town of 400 people located on the remote great northern peninsula of newfoundland her first husband was a welder who was born and raised in the town by july of 1982 the two welcomed shirley's first child a son Due to their low income, they were awarded what is known in Canada as a monthly baby bonus.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
This tax-free money is given to underprivileged families to help raise their children and afford them the rights that all Canadians are meant to have access to. Shirley put this money into a scholarship fund so her son could attend any university he wanted to as an adult. But as you'll soon see, that didn't exactly go as planned.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Shirley's lover lived on Labrador's south coast, a 10-hour drive away from where she and her husband were living. So, how does a person have an affair with someone that far away in the age before the internet, with two small kids to take care of and little to no money? Well, Shirley would routinely drive from her home in Labrador to the northern Great Peninsula, 10 hours away.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
After the 10-hour drive, she would then take a ferry, drop her kids off on the island with a relative, and then ferry back to Labrador to meet up with her lover. Then, after she would retrace her steps, taking the ferry to the island to get her kids, then back to Labrador, then do the 10 hour drive back to her husband.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
So following this, the Department of Social Services started looking into things. They actually spoke with this man's therapist, who said that he had witnessed the older daughter being struck in the face by her mother for no reason. Shirley always swears and curses at the child and sometimes at her son.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Shirley has left the oldest daughter at home on weekends and evenings unsupervised, and she has to go to school on the bus unsupervised. This has been ongoing for two months.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And just months after the report was closed, Shirley told her family that she could no longer raise her kids because of her rigorous medical school workload. Naturally, her family was upset about this, but Shirley was unbothered. In her mind, her kids were getting in the way, and she didn't want to take care of them anymore.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
So, from here, her son and oldest daughter were sent to live with Shirley's ex-mother-in-law, Adelaide, and her youngest daughter was sent to live with her biological father, about eight hours away from St. John's.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In the summer of 1998, Shirley traveled the 21 hours over to Halifax and showed up at Miles' front door, uninvited and unannounced. When he opened his door that day, he couldn't believe that she was standing there. And not knowing what else to do, he made the mistake of letting Shirley inside. But as soon as she stepped in, Shirley made it very clear that she wasn't going to leave.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In fact, she essentially moved into his house against his will. And because he was afraid to call the police, he felt letting her stay was the path of least resistance. But Shirley Turner wasn't easily pleased. During one minor argument, Shirley took the high-heeled shoe she was wearing and drove it into Miles' jaw. Over the next few days, Miles was terrified.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
was very clear to him that shirley was extremely unstable it got so bad he even took her to the psychiatric hospital where she was placed on an overnight hold following this interaction shirley luckily returned back to st john's and miles was ready to completely cut ties he even decided to move again this time to pennsylvania and he made sure that shirley did not have his address but soon enough his phone became flooded with calls from her
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Clearly, Miles had moved on from Shirley and Shirley was not taking this news kindly.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Now, it's important to note that what I'm about to say next comes from an investigation conducted and published by the Newfoundland and Labrador's child and youth advocate's delegate, Peter H. Marketstein, assisted by legal counsel David Day.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
This is a 500-page document detailing the history of this case in full, and it is where we've gotten the majority of our information, as well as David Bagby's book and the documentary Dear Zachary. That is to say, this is their professional opinion and isn't meant to downplay suicidal ideation.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But essentially, they determined that the combination of medications that Shirley took was unlikely to be fatal. In the report, it is stated, Whether this was a suicide attempt or a suicide gesture, I cannot address. As a physician, Dr. Turner would have been aware and probably had access to medications much more likely to have efficiently and expeditiously occasioned her death.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Moreover, in choosing the portals of a former boyfriend's apartment for her demise, she probably had calculated the prospect of being discovered and thereby rescued from the potential, gradually lethal effects of the substances she consumed. Now, it's not uncommon for emotionally abusive partners to use the threat of suicide in order to manipulate, coerce, and hurt the people around them.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And when you hear what Shirley did next, it seems pretty clear that that's what she was trying to do here.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Andrew was raised in Santa Clara Valley in the Bay Area of California, and from the beginning, he was the type of kid who everyone loved. Andrew always had a big group of friends, friends that he had throughout his entire life up until his death.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Just a few weeks after attempting suicide on Miles' front steps, Shirley started dating Andrew. That means that during this period where she was berating Miles with calls, knocking on his door, and being told to leave by police, she was actively seeing Andrew Bagby. But Andrew clearly didn't know this dark side of the new woman in his life.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
This podcast is not for everyone. You have been warned.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Now, a lot of the information from this episode comes from the film that his childhood best friend, Kurt Kuhn, made about his life and death titled Dear Zachary, a letter to a son about his father. We highly recommend watching the film after this episode if you'd like to put faces to names and truly see how loved Andrew was.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
He stated, she became quite hostile, yelling, crying, and accusing me of treating her unfairly. Twice she hung up on me during telephone conversations. She lied right to my face and forcibly argued her case accusing me of improper supervision.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The head physician told investigators she missed nine days of this three-month rotation. Most residents miss one day per year. She used excuses such as her children being sick, migraine headaches, or no excuses at all.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
According to the head physician, we were so concerned about Shirley Turner's approach to confrontation and the truth that we would never give her feedback or hold any major discussion with her alone. This is the only time in my 21 years of teaching that I've had to use this approach. You might say Dr. Turner was a manipulative, guiltless psychopath. She was cute, petite, and always looked injured.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She just fooled everyone, I think."
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In the summer of 2000, it was time for Shirley and Andrew's careers to begin. Seeking a job as a surgical doctor, Andrew took on that surgical residency in the US in Syracuse, New York. Meanwhile, with her residency completed, Shirley decided to take a family practice position in Sac City, Iowa. Her annual salary was estimated to be $117,000 per year.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But growing up, Andrew and his best friend Kurt often filmed movies and comedy sketches together. They had a camera and a huge imagination, which made for some funny videos together throughout the years. In their films, Andrew liked to play the villains, which everyone agreed he enjoyed because it was so opposing to his true personality.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Her children stayed behind in Newfoundland, except for her oldest daughter who was 15. She told Shirley that she wanted to move to Ontario to live with a boy she had met. I don't know about you, but when I was 15, I had plenty of plans that were stupid and dangerous as well. But fortunately, my parents were smart enough to not let me go through with most of them. Shirley, however, approved.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She sent her 15-year-old daughter across the country with $700 to her name so that she could set up homeschooling. Imagine for a moment letting your young teenage daughter relocate to be with a boy and be in charge of her own education. In retrospect, the Canadian government has stated that this arrangement should have resulted in child protective services being contacted.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Meanwhile, when Shirley moved to the U.S., it wasn't just her oldest daughter who was struggling. Her son had just turned 18 and was ready to attend college, only to discover that his mother had spent every dollar of the baby bonus she was supposed to put away for his education. He was devastated and was forced to take on two jobs while in school to afford tuition.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But as you can see, Shirley's focus was not on her children at this time. She had her own life here in the United States, and all of her focus at this point was for her boyfriend, Andrew Bagby. One thing we know for sure is that in the fall of 2001, Andrew was over Shirley. He no longer wanted to be the focus of her attention.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Perhaps he saw a glimpse into her disturbing behaviors, and wanting to do what was best for his life, he attempted to break things off with her.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
It also helped that it gave him a free pass to swear in front of his parents. because in the end, it wasn't him cussing, it was his character. David and Kate definitely had their hands full with a bunch of teenage boys filming gangster movies in their house, but they loved it.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The Bagbys welcomed the creative outlet for Andrew and his friends, and in fact, on more than one occasion, the two parents were even roped into the productions and given roles, playing characters straight from teenagers' minds like evil teachers and bosses. And I can heavily relate to this because when I was younger, I used to make movies all the time.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
After Andrew's murder, Shirley had moved into a home in St. John's, Newfoundland, and since then, they had been keeping surveillance on her home. Then, on December 2, 2001, investigators searched this home, and in one of the trash cans, they found an ultrasound. As it turns out, Shirley wasn't lying. She was pregnant, and according to her, it was Andrew's baby.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
so from there things got much more complicated by this point with all the evidence against her investigators finally had enough to get an arrest warrant for shirley but keep in mind shirley murdered andrew in the united states then afterwards she fled to canada and refused to come back so arresting her wouldn't be that easy
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
First, the Canadian government would have to place her under arrest, and then she would have to be extradited back to the United States. So for now, she was still a free woman. But for Andrew's parents, they were going through a whirlwind of emotions. Kate and David struggled to get out of bed in the morning.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
David couldn't stand seeing Kate in such a horrible state, refusing to eat, suffering from nightmares, and sobbing until she had no more tears. After learning that Shirley would be arrested, of course they were happy. Shirley was finally going to get the justice she deserved. But they also couldn't believe that she was carrying Andrew's baby.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And as chaotic as this situation was, it somehow brought them some comfort. After losing their son, their grief was insurmountable. But now, they had a piece of him coming into this world. On December 15th, David wrote in his journal, Kate wants to raise the baby. I can live with that. The baby will be born into a pit. And we are in a pit. So maybe we can all help each other climb out.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
More than anything, Andrew's loved ones wanted to see Shirley Turner in prison, where she belonged. And luckily, on December 12, 2001, their wishes would be granted. That day, Shirley was taken into custody in St. John's under provisional arrest. But to everyone's surprise, it wouldn't be long until she was back out on the streets.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I actually broke, I think it was five of my family's cameras when I was growing up. I had an obsession with film. I used to make zombie movies with my friends. My parents would help out. They would build blood cannons and do special effects zombie makeup with me. It was a very, very fun period of my life that was really formative for me.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
As it turned out, Shirley's ex-husbands each signed promising $5,000 in sureties each if Shirley was to run. But even more shocking was that her psychiatrist posted $65,000 in sureties. That's a lot of money to give over to one of your patients. And based on Shirley's past, her psychiatrist had to have known she was incredibly unstable.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But sadly, enough money was raised for Shirley Turner to be released from custody. The United States and Canadian Council agreed on this judgment, stating that Shirley somehow was not a threat to the public since her alleged crime was specific in nature. In other words, if she did murder Andrew, she had already achieved her goal and she probably wasn't going to murder anyone else.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In addition, the court stated that she had been very cooperative thus far in the investigation. Now, I'm not entirely sure how fleeing to another country and refusing to return to the United States is cooperative, but regardless, Shirley was allowed to walk free while she awaited extradition to the United States.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
because of the pending case shirley was visited by child youth and family service in late july upon visiting the home the caseworker noted that shirley's youngest daughter whom she had retained custody of was doing the majority of the child rearing at the time her daughter was only 11 years old
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
now given the situation you would think zachary would be removed from his mother's care or perhaps given to the bagby's after all his mother was a cold-blooded killer however that wasn't the case instead the worker had a parent coach arranged to assist shirley the parent coach visited for four hours over the next 14 days completely free of charge for shirley
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And I'm so blessed that I had family and friends that supported what I wanted to do, even as far as back then. But anyways, let's keep going.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
ended up going to family court where the bagby's begged to have two one-hour weekly visits with zachary and no direct contact with shirley shirley however wanted only one hour-long visit a week that was fully supervised and demanded that there be a bag and body search of kate and david as if they were going to pull out a weapon and hurt him
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In addition, Shirley wanted taxi service to be covered for her and Zachary on visitation days. Her requests were ridiculous, but of course, David and Kate agreed. They were desperate to see their grandson, even if it meant catering to Shirley's insane demands.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
On top of that, Kate and David routinely took care of Shirley's 12-year-old daughter. Surprisingly, from November to January, both Shirley and the country of Canada let the 12-year-old live by herself in Shirley's old apartment. Yes, you heard that correctly. A 12-year-old was left to their own devices.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
This was because Shirley argued that her daughter had appropriate supervision, which was occasional visits from her older brother and pop-in visits from her neighbors upstairs. Of course, the social workers were required to check in on the 12-year-old, yet they only made two home visits in that two-month period.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Despite Shirley's daughter routinely being out of groceries, unkempt, and unable to be contacted, the social workers didn't seem concerned. In fact, on December 11th, they even terminated her counseling sessions, stating that she had good coping skills.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Desperate for some kind of escape and some connection to Andrew, Kate and David decided to go to the movies to clear their heads. The movies had always been a comfort in times of trouble for their family, ever since Andrew was a little boy acting in them and using them as a fun excuse to cuss in front of his parents.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
So on that day, after giving Zachary back to Shirley, they went to the movies to watch The Lord of the Rings The Two Towers. Andrew had always loved The Lord of the Rings books growing up, so the movie seemed fitting. Now, this movie, if you haven't seen it, is actually about a battle between good and evil.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And as they were watching it, they couldn't help but think about how it mirrored their very lives. One part in the movie, in particular, brought the Bagby's to tears as they held each other in the dim light of the screen.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
On Zachary's first birthday, held in a McDonald's play place, Shirley became hysterical after Zachary went to Kate for comfort instead of her. She even told Kate, he obviously loves you more than me. Kate and David were forced to hold Shirley's hands, rub her back, and remind her that Zachary loved her more than anything. Imagine having to do that to your son's killer.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
On July 4th, Shirley went on a date with a man several years younger than her. After being intimate, the man disclosed to Shirley that he didn't want to pursue a romantic relationship with her. It's also around this time when this man discovered that Shirley had murder charges against her for the death of Andrew Bagmey, so he tried to put as much distance between them as possible.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But as you can imagine, Shirley wasn't going to let that happen. Between July 12th and August 13th, she called the man over 200 times. Each time he heard the phone ring, he refused to pick it up. He was scared. He even called the police on multiple occasions to let them know what she was doing, though he didn't want to press charges.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Then, on August 11th, Shirley told the man that she was pregnant with his baby. She threatened repeatedly that she was going to get an abortion, but by this point, the man had completely stopped talking to her. I guess she assumed that telling him she was pregnant would get his attention, but it didn't.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
So after that, Shirley left him a message stating that she had canceled the abortion appointment and was going to keep the child. However, that very next day, she changed her mind again. She left him another message stating that she had rescheduled the appointment and was terminating her pregnancy that afternoon.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She told him that he was a fucking immature asshole for refusing to meet up with her so they could discuss the plans for their child together. On multiple occasions, she called him to harass him, stating, you're so fucking immature acting this way. grow up and be a fucking man. At this point, the man called the police and agreed to file a report against Shirley.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
However, when she was confronted about the matter, she claimed that she hadn't been making any harassing phone calls. In fact, she wasn't even pregnant. Shirley claimed that this was all a ruse to get her into trouble. Now, you would think that this would be the end of Shirley's harassment, but of course it wasn't.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Days later, she called the man again, telling him that she actually was pregnant and that she had an ultrasound now to prove it. But by now, this guy was completely done with Shirley. He even told her that he would no longer be speaking to her, and if she needed anything, she would have to contact his attorney. But as it turned out, Shirley was obviously lying.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
She wasn't pregnant with this man's child. It was yet another sick, manipulative game she was playing to try and keep another man who didn't want her in her life.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Andrew had known he wanted to be a doctor from a young age, but soon after graduating, he was rejected from the college he wanted to attend. But not wanting him to be discouraged, Heather showed him a brochure for another college on a whim. Except for, there was a catch. The college was in Canada. Memorial University School of Medicine, otherwise known as MUN,
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The security guard of the Fox Trap Marina on Conception Bay South had a long night ahead of him. Tucked away in a tiny shed to protect him from the raging storm outside, he had his CD player going for comfort. But a little after 2am, he heard a sound that stood out against the wind and the rain. It was a sound that had no earthly reason to be ringing out of the storm at this time of night.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
He later told investigators, I could still hear the person's footsteps. All I could pick out about what the person was wearing was something like a white t-shirt. I called out, is anyone there? No one answered. As close as I ever was to the person was a couple of meters, which was at the time I first came out of the shed.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I watched the person walk away, from where I stood close to the outside of the shed, along the old railway track path, out of sight into the pitch black. The old railway track path runs behind the shed and the area where you go onto the main wharf of the marina as the path curves away from the marina.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I couldn't tell if the person was male or female because the person was back onto me and it was very dark.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
is about as far away as Andrew could get in North America from where he grew up in California. For reference, there are no direct flights from San Francisco to St. John, Newfoundland, and traveling there from California takes about 10 hours of flying. But despite this, Andrew was interested in Memorial University School of Medicine, St. John's is often compared to San Francisco.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
zachary would have been rendered unconscious by the medication so luckily he didn't suffer their bodies were later discovered in a cove several miles away the next day when kate and david heard the news they collapsed onto the floor and sobbed they then had to go and identify zachary's body something that felt all too familiar they also remembered the mistake they felt they had made with andrew just two years prior
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
What bothers Kate is that she did not go with him to the crematorium and stay with him right to the end.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I hate her for a lot of things. Stealing the rest of Andrew's life, and virtually all of Zachary's life, and then this. Leaving us like this.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
In the clip, you can see David trying to contain his anger as Kate sobs. He keeps his arm around her the entire time, comforting her. Their worlds had just been destroyed for a second time, all by the same woman, Shirley Turner. With Zachary's body, David and Kate decided to cremate him and then bury his remains alongside his father's.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But from there, they were left to pick up the pieces of their shattered lives. Yet, they continued to fight to ensure that no other families would endure what they did.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
The downtown is laced with steep hills, colorful row buildings, and fog from the nearby ocean. Originally founded as a fishing port, it's a city that's relied on the ocean and the hardiness of its people to survive. Now, many people would probably be turned off by the idea of moving to a place so isolated and cold, but Andrew leapt at the opportunity to try something new.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Additionally, the psychiatrist who posted bail for Shirley, John Doucette, was reprimanded for misconduct and ordered to pay a $10,000 fine. But the judge who ruled that Shirley wasn't a danger to society, Justice Gail Welsh, faced no repercussions at all and was allowed to continue her career until she retired in 2022.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
To this day, Andrew's family and friends joined together to celebrate days that should have been milestones in his life. On September 25th, 2023, on what would have been Andrew's 50th birthday, a group of people from all over the country gathered at a winery on the coast of California to toast him.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Kate and David sat at the head of the table, surrounded by filmmakers from Dear Zachary, friends from Andrew's life as Dr. Bagby in California, his college years in Newfoundland, and his childhood years in California. For years, Kate and David worked advocating for and supporting other parents who had lost their children to homicide.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
They pushed for policy change and urged the whole world to hear the story of their son and grandson. Now they're in their golden years, a time where people look back on their lives. David and Kate have a lot to look back on and a lot to be proud of.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
I think the moment of them celebrating what would have been Andrew's 50th birthday is a testament to not only their legacy, but how remarkable their parenting was. Even over 20 years after the death of their son, people are still gathering from around the world to speak about how incredible of a man he was. People aren't willing to let him fully die, and neither are Kate and David.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
They fought for their boys until the bitter end, and out of their struggle, they've saved countless other families from enduring what they have.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
At the end of this show, Courtney and I want to announce that we're going to make a donation to the Dr. Andrew Bagby Family Medicine Scholarship, a scholarship based in Latrobe, Pennsylvania, that has given dozens of students the opportunity to practice family medicine over a four-week program in the same medical center where Andrew made himself a home and served his community.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And we encourage all of our listeners to do the same. Well, thank you everybody for listening to this week's episode of Murder in America. Courtney and I actually watched this film a few months ago. I had seen it recommended. I'd never watched it. Neither had Courtney. And it was like a profoundly impactful movie. I would highly recommend go watching the documentary.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Courtney and I were like sobbing at the end. It's just so well made. And the story is just really infuriating. All the red flags, the warning signs, the failures. It's just really strange how they seem to just want to let this murderer out into the free world and no one ever faced repercussions for it.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
It's kind of like all these stories, these justice individuals, people in the justice system make these flawed decisions and they're never punished.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
for those decisions even you know at times like in this story when the price for those failures or indecision is the life of in this case an infant but if you want to hear more episodes of murder in america you can go sign up for our patreon where we have bonus episodes of the show full-length episodes with courtney and i the same exact type of episodes that are on our main feed we post multiple episodes a month
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
on the patreon for our patreon members and also if you don't like the ads you can listen to the ad free version of every episode which is also posted the day before it goes live on all streaming platforms so if you don't like the ads if you want bonus content consider joining us on patreon Also, if you could please leave us a five-star review wherever you're listening to your podcasts.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And don't forget to follow us on Instagram at Murder in America to see photos from every story that we cover here on the show. This is a crazy story. What an episode. But thank you all so much for tuning in. Catch you on the next one.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
But breakups are hard on everyone. Andrew's parents, David and Kate, loved Heather. In fact, when Andrew went back to MUN to continue his studies, Heather actually lived with them for a while before she ultimately went back to school. But that's the kind of people David and Kate are. They not only took care of Andrew, but also his friends whenever they needed it.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
And to this day, 30 years later, Heather still keeps in contact with Kate and David.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Now, soon after Andrew and Shirley started dating, Andrew went back home to California to visit his family. And before leaving, he had given Shirley his parents' home phone number so they could keep in touch while he was gone. And sure enough, while there, Shirley called. Andrew's mother, Kate, was actually the one who answered the phone.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
It was their first time talking that day, though it would be far, far from their last. Kate claims that she introduced herself and told Shirley that Andrew wasn't home, but Shirley didn't seem to mind. She hardly drew a breath as she launched into her own life story and talked to Kate for over an hour. Having never met her, Kate was shocked and didn't exactly know how to leave the conversation.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
After eventually hanging up, she told David, who was curious about Andrew's new girlfriend, she seems nice enough, but she's hard to end a conversation with. But little did Kate know, this would soon become a habit for Shirley. Before long, Shirley was calling them all the time, just to talk to Andrew's parents, and she would keep them on the phone for hours at a time as she rambled.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Eventually, they started coming up with excuses for why they were hanging up, and they even began to screen their calls so that they could avoid Shirley's long rants. But Kate and David never imagined that Shirley was dangerous. Sure, she was a little annoying, but in the end, I'm sure they were thankful that their son's girlfriend liked them enough to even want to talk to them.
Murder In America
EP. 180 : PENNSYLVANIA - The "Dear Zachary" Case
Shirley was also nice, charming, and intelligent. And more importantly, they could tell that she really loved their son, which is all they could have ever wanted for him.