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Sir Niall Ferguson

๐Ÿ‘ค Speaker
435 total appearances

Appearances Over Time

Podcast Appearances

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

And there was a general feeling that the big guy doesn't love us and the big guy doesn't get the economy.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

and we're all going to move to Singapore, or we're all going to get out.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

So this was the kind of conversation 12 months ago.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Now the conversation is, well, he seems to get the message now, so we're actually getting some sensible policy advice out of the two sessions, out of the kind of policy discussion in Beijing, and he loves Jack Ma again, and the rehabilitation of Jack Ma, as well as the fating of Chinese entrepreneurs, including the DeepSeek founders, to send a signal

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

to the Chinese private sector, the big guy, i.e.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Xi Jinping, gets the message.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

We're course-correcting at the macro level, and we're also recognizing that you guys are indeed the rock stars of the Chinese economy.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

So this is important because it means that the mood in China has changed.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Now, let me make two distinct points.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Number one, the technology story is unquestionably very impressive.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

I can remember meeting Kai-Fu Lee last year in Beijing, and he said, despite the constraints imposed by the U.S.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Commerce Department that restricts China's access to GPUs, the most sophisticated semiconductors, China's going to just do so well, at least at inference, so well at adoption that it will be able to hold its own in AI.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

That turns out to be pretty much right.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Yeah.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

And so I think there's a big deal here, which is the success of China in not circumventing, but simply overcoming the obstacles put in its way by the Biden administration mostly.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

But the second point, which I don't think is getting enough attention, is that it is really hard to turn the macro around in China.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Because consumption took such a hit between COVID, zero COVID going on and on and on, and the crisis in the property sector, households, which predominantly middle-class households save by acquiring apartments, have been rinsed.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Their balance sheets are a disaster.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

And it is really hard for the Chinese government to turn that around.

Azeem Azhar's Exponential View
Sir Niall Ferguson decodes Trump, China, and the new world order

Two really striking things.