Steve Greenblatt

So that's just a little bit of a background of who a programmer is.

One of the things when you're hiring is that if you are coming across people that really don't fit that mold, I'm not saying that they couldn't be a good programmer, but many times they're going to have to really stretch outside their comfort zone to fit that role.

And they may not long-term be happy doing it because it creates stress when you're not being who you are.

I'll get off of my personality type rant for a bit and just talk a little bit too just about the importance that what programmers are looking for.

Programmers want to be able to have a career path.

They want to know that a company is going to invest in them.

They want to be able to achieve certifications and be trained.

That to me I think is very important.

And not all employers look at that because a lot of them are fearful of that because they feel like they're investing in somebody that may ultimately leave.

And I know James, he said many, many times about that, and I'll let him share.

But it's important, I think, to show a program or a pathway.

While they can do repetitive tasks and they can be very good at them, they also want to be able to have some creativity and have some liberties to do some things differently.

They want to know that their voice is being heard and they want to be able to contribute.

I think that involving them in designs and letting them interact with clients is

and giving them the guardrails to be able to do stuff like that would be very important.

Sometimes they may be too honest.

That's one thing to be wary of.

But what I've also found too, and this may not just be related to programmers, is that

You have to really keep it interesting for them because people these days tend to go from job to job after maybe four or five years.

I think that it's just become more of a common thing of younger generations.