Steven Bartlett

I mean, I'm sure there are some restrictions on who's able to get passports and who isn't.

But say you were able to.

You'd need to go somewhere where you could get a visa, where you could work.

Mm-hmm.

where you could set up a life, where you speak the language, where it's reasonable to imagine you could stay there for a long time.

I mean, immigration, especially given languages and professional qualifications, so it is not always easy.

It's not always practical for everybody.

I mean, I have friends who are still – I have many friends who left Russia, but I have one or two friends who are still there.

And that's because they have aging relatives or because they don't speak any other languages and they don't feel they'd be at home anywhere else.

I mean, there are many reasons why people can't leave, even if they don't like their state or they don't like their political system.

You've used the word power.

Control over power ministries and the use of violence.

Most autocracies, sooner or later, want to create some kind of repressive system that's also physical.

So it's not just control of the information space.

There's also some element of coercion.

So people who don't go along with the system don't get to just float around.

There's some way of threatening them physically.

So ICE is not supposed to be that.

ICE is supposed to be an immigration enforcement institution.

But the way it's been used is well beyond the way any immigration institution was used before in the United States.