Tim Ross

And I think that there was a lesson there, I thought.

So tell me, when you talk about the craftsmen that you work with, and you work with a lot of crafts people and you respect, you collaborate with, right?

We do, yeah.

It's always fascinating to hear from you the story of the object, why it's there, how it came to be, who these people are, where on the planet they are, what they do.

But for you, is the narrative of the object and being able to tell the narrative, is that essential?

Was there a turning point in the practice's work where you think actually this is what we should do more of, where you've embraced craft...

For a start, the shape of it's an embrace, and it's a warm human colour.

It's a flesh-like colour.

So there's a tremendous appeal, a sort of informality about it.

And an informality also in the texturality of it.

Is that a word?

Yeah, texturality.

Texturality.

If not, I just invented it.

Yeah, I like texturality.

But the way, I mean, it's a deliberately rough-and-ready finish, isn't it?

it's a ceramic house it's made from terracotta clay it's as much as possible it's made from earth but the joinery as ever in your work is a place where you kind of you get millimeter perfect and you get there must be a tremendous satisfaction is joinery a is it indispensable could you imagine building a house without that very fine grain

Yeah.

I mean, equally, of course, there are those buildings that look great, as you say, as a profiler, you know, from 500 metres and you get closer and closer and the closer you get, the worse the building looks.

I mean, it can be detailed.