Vince Chan

Great. Now, last question of the day. But before I ask, let me share a quick story. A friend of mine has a niece, 27 years old. She still hasn't graduated from college. She's been stuck in school, hasn't worked a single job, not even part-time, not volunteering, not freelancing, not investing, nothing. Her parents, who are middle class, fully support her.

Great. Now, last question of the day. But before I ask, let me share a quick story. A friend of mine has a niece, 27 years old. She still hasn't graduated from college. She's been stuck in school, hasn't worked a single job, not even part-time, not volunteering, not freelancing, not investing, nothing. Her parents, who are middle class, fully support her.

But in their eyes, she isn't being productive, not even trying to do anything meaningful. is not about making big money. It's about learning something, adding value, contributing in some way. But she seems to have taken the idea of not needing a traditional job to the extreme, believing that work itself isn't necessary for her generation.

But in their eyes, she isn't being productive, not even trying to do anything meaningful. is not about making big money. It's about learning something, adding value, contributing in some way. But she seems to have taken the idea of not needing a traditional job to the extreme, believing that work itself isn't necessary for her generation.

Now, the reason I bring this up is because your book is titled, Employment is Dead. I understand what you mean by that. I don't misinterpret it. But I can see how some people might. They might take it at face value and think, oh, we don't have to work anymore. We don't need offices, five-day work weeks, or even jobs at all. I don't think that's the message you're trying to send.

Now, the reason I bring this up is because your book is titled, Employment is Dead. I understand what you mean by that. I don't misinterpret it. But I can see how some people might. They might take it at face value and think, oh, we don't have to work anymore. We don't need offices, five-day work weeks, or even jobs at all. I don't think that's the message you're trying to send.

So my last question to you is this. Do you really believe employment is dead? And more importantly, what is your true interpretation of that phrase? Whether someone watching this is 15, 25, 35, or 45, How do you want them to understand what you mean so the title doesn't get misinterpreted as something superficial?

So my last question to you is this. Do you really believe employment is dead? And more importantly, what is your true interpretation of that phrase? Whether someone watching this is 15, 25, 35, or 45, How do you want them to understand what you mean so the title doesn't get misinterpreted as something superficial?

Embrace life stage flexibility with purpose. We need to work. We need to country-build, put in the effort, and build our lives and careers. There are so many different ways to do that now. That's the message. In that sense, employment isn't dead. It's just evolving. The traditional model may be fading, but it's being re-imagined in new and meaningful ways. Absolutely. Deborah, thank you so much.

Embrace life stage flexibility with purpose. We need to work. We need to country-build, put in the effort, and build our lives and careers. There are so many different ways to do that now. That's the message. In that sense, employment isn't dead. It's just evolving. The traditional model may be fading, but it's being re-imagined in new and meaningful ways. Absolutely. Deborah, thank you so much.

I really appreciate you taking the time for this conversation. And congratulations on the entire journey of putting this book together. If I make it to the U.S., I'll be sure to grab an autographed copy from both of you.

I really appreciate you taking the time for this conversation. And congratulations on the entire journey of putting this book together. If I make it to the U.S., I'll be sure to grab an autographed copy from both of you.

Of course. I'm not Bloomberg. I don't ask cookie-cutter questions. And that's a wrap on this two-part series with Deborah Perry Pistioni. We've torn apart outdated career playbooks, reimagined what work could be, and tackled how both workers and companies must evolve. The question now is, are you ready for what's next? Because the future of work isn't coming. It's already here.

Of course. I'm not Bloomberg. I don't ask cookie-cutter questions. And that's a wrap on this two-part series with Deborah Perry Pistioni. We've torn apart outdated career playbooks, reimagined what work could be, and tackled how both workers and companies must evolve. The question now is, are you ready for what's next? Because the future of work isn't coming. It's already here.

If you found this conversation valuable, share it, rate the show, and let's keep pushing these conversations forward. Thank you so much for joining us today. If you like what you heard, don't forget, subscribe to our show, leave us top-rated reviews, check out our website, and follow me on social media. I'm Vince Shen, your ambitious human host. Until next time, take care.

If you found this conversation valuable, share it, rate the show, and let's keep pushing these conversations forward. Thank you so much for joining us today. If you like what you heard, don't forget, subscribe to our show, leave us top-rated reviews, check out our website, and follow me on social media. I'm Vince Shen, your ambitious human host. Until next time, take care.

hi everyone welcome to our show chief change officer i'm vince chen your ambitious human host our show is a modernist humility for change progressives in organizational and human transformation from around the world A few days ago, we published a three-part series with George Dream, the co-author of the book, Employment is Dead. But we are not done yet. We are doubling down on this conversation.

hi everyone welcome to our show chief change officer i'm vince chen your ambitious human host our show is a modernist humility for change progressives in organizational and human transformation from around the world A few days ago, we published a three-part series with George Dream, the co-author of the book, Employment is Dead. But we are not done yet. We are doubling down on this conversation.

Today, I've invited his co-author, Deborah Perry-Piccioni. an entrepreneur, Silicon Valley insider, and best-selling author of the book Secrets of Silicon Valley. Before diving into the world of startups, Debra spent 18 years in Washington, D.C., working in the White House, on Capitol Hill, and as a political commentator for MSNBC, Fox News, and CNN.

Today, I've invited his co-author, Deborah Perry-Piccioni. an entrepreneur, Silicon Valley insider, and best-selling author of the book Secrets of Silicon Valley. Before diving into the world of startups, Debra spent 18 years in Washington, D.C., working in the White House, on Capitol Hill, and as a political commentator for MSNBC, Fox News, and CNN.